Trainz Demo Avaliable

[Boweavel]

http://www.strategyfirst.com/en/

Heya Guy's.. Just thought i'd let some know that strategy first have released a 55.5mb download for folks to try out this game..

Im not sure as to whats in the download as i have the real thing and therefore havent grabbed the Demo..

Hopefully folks will enjoy.

Catchya's

[ChckHbrt]

Hey I tried the demo and:

I'll keep the Train Sim Thank You

Chuck

[TucsonCoyote]

Tucson Coyote Here

I Just Downloaded the Demo and Installed it.. And Now I just Can't Get enough of it..(Frankly It Makes Me Wonder why Microsoft DIDN'T invent this one! (I think when I show my Roommate this Demo When He Get's home, We'll Probably Say.. So Long MSTS Hello Trainz...

Tucson Coyote

[VRfan]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-22-01 AT 10:06AM (EST)[p]I downloaded it and tried it out. It was pretty much what I expected. While the driver module is reasonable, I still think MSTS is a better game if you want to drive trains. However, when it comes to route editing, there is no comparison. Surveyor is incredibly easy to use and I had a simple one baseboard layout in less than 10 minutes (note, you can't save in the demo). I will probably buy Trainz just to get the Surveyor module. Even if you aren't that interested in making routes, Surveyor's ease of use will have you hooked.

BTW, it runs fine on my PII400 with 320mb RAM and a 32mb GeForce 2 MX if I lower the terrain detail a little bit. :D

I just have one question to those who already have Trainz (and therefore the manual :-)). Is there a full range of keyboard shortcuts like MSTS? I find the mouse an extremely clumsy way of operating the locomotive.

--

http://members.optushome.com.au/jrbrook/pics/icon.jpg

Victorian Railfan Web Site:
http://www.railpage.org.au/vr/

[Boweavel]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-22-01 AT 11:01AM (EST)[p]I too bought Trainz basically for the Terrain editing tools.. Now Im surely glad of my investment.. The fact that MSTS stuffed my O\S which ultimatley led to the demise of the puter, Is really the only reason ive gave up on it.. I would love to merge the driving capabilities of MSTS to the surveyor module..Then it would be sweet.. Having said that tho i must add that i Have barely at all..Ever driven from the cab view. I have always used the little DCC control because its how i like it..Want instant speed ?..cant be bothered waiting for it to struggle up that grade for 2 hours ?..Well just notch the DCC up and watch her fly... I Love that :-) And it can stop just as quick :-)
The Cab View i am told has all the Realism necasery.. I drove it just tonight to test my layout ..just to see how the realism buff would handle the route.. Gotta say in the short 5 mins i ran it..It was pretty darn MSTS'ish to me :-) I used the mouse as i do throughout the whole game and only just found out (Because im to laxy to read the manual) that there are key commands for anything and everything :P

Im glad to hear some of ya's are enjoying it and some arent.. I thought maybe i was the only one that was hooked on it.. After 3 weeks i still have to learn alot to it..But the things i can do now... Well... Darn great.. Soz.. :P

Wow..after that.....Ive forgotten what i was on about......

Heh..Typical................

Catchya's

[Boweavel]

Fresh of the trainz website.. (Well might not be fresh..)

Apperently the wrong key suggestions went with the demo..Here they are.

Quick Start:

To begin a Driver session, drag and drop loco's and rolling stock onto the "consist window" at the bottom of the Driver screen. Next, click on Terrain and choose the terrain you wish to drive on. Then click on one of the arrows on the mini-map to place your consist. (You can create and add multiple consists by using the scroll arrows in the consist window). The final step before clicking the green light is to go into settings to choose weather and driving conditions and to save all these settings for quick loading next time.

Driver - Summary Of Controls

Internal View

RMB drag left - look left
RMB drag right - look right
RMB drag up - look up
RMB drag down - look down

Chase View

RMB drag left - rotate clockwise around subject
RMB drag right - rotate anti-clockwise around subject
RMB drag up - rotate up over subject
RMB drag down - rotate down below subject

RMB + LMB drag up - zoom into subject
RMB + LMB drag down - zoom away from subject
MWHEEL up - zoom into subject
MWHEEL down - zoom away from subject

Tracking View

No mouse control

Map Screen

LMB on consist - select/deselect consist
RMB on map - scroll map and centre on location

LMB on UP arrow - scroll map up
LMB on DOWN arrow - scroll map down
LMB on LEFT arrow - scroll map left
LMB on RIGHT arrow - scroll map right
LMB on + icon - zoom in
LMB on – icon - zoom out

DCC Control

. or > - spin right (accelerate forward)
, or < - spin left (accelerate reverse)
/ or ? - centre (stop)

Cabin Control

REVERSER
NUMPAD * - forward
NUMPAD / - reverse

THROTTLE
NUMPAD 8 - accelerate
NUMPAD 2 - decelerate

BRAKING
NUMPAD 3 - apply brakes
NUMPAD 6 - lap brakes
NUMPAD 9 - release brakes
PAUSE/BREAK - emergency

DYNAMIC BRAKING
NUMPAD 7 - engage/disengage

PANTOGRAPH
NUMPAD 4 - up/down

AUXILIARY EQUIPMENT
NUMPAD + - horn
NUMPAD - - sand
B - bell
L - headlight
I - toggle ‘Imperial’ & ‘Metric’ display

CAMERA
Right cursor key - look right
Left cursor key - look left
Up cursor key - look up
Down cursor key - look down

General
SPACEBAR toggles the consist display window
F1 toggles the Train Cameras panel
F2 toggles the Junction Cameras panel
F3 toggles the Turntable Cameras panel
F4 toggles the DCC controller or Statistics panel
1 go to Internal View
2 go to Chase View
3 go to Tracking View
M toggle the Map Screen
D activate Decouple
P pause
ESC Quit Driver, or close current dialogue

Thanks to Tony Hilliam for posting them up.

Catchya's

[Vince]

Thanx to Bo for posting the keyboard commands. I got the demo and have run it for several hours, driver and editing. My impressions:
Surveyor tool is great, much easier than MSTS editors after I got used to the navigating. The detail level is not quite up to par though. Track switches (turnouts) detail is lacking and those big red/green arrows spoil the realism of the sim.
Sound is not as good as MSTS. No doppler effects. Engine horn, one short toot? Whats up with that?
Cab view is realistic but a bit tough to operate. Can the controls be operated by mouse? Can't seem to get them to move.Maybe it's just the demo?
The consist wheels in the demo do not rotate when the train is moving. Is this the demo or is this the way it is? A steam engine would look silly without rotating drivers.
Nice spark effects from wheels when rounding a curve at speed. Now speed...Hmmm...The demo gets up to speed almost instantly and stops even quicker. This is very unrealistic and disappointing, however I hacked into the engine files and was able, by setting the RESISTANCE parameter from it's default 0.95 to a lower value. Play with this and see what you get. With the parameter set to 0.1 the train will coast a good distance when stop is pressed. Thank you Auran for making the engine files editable with a simple text editor.

Bottom line: I will purchase the sim when it arrives in stores just to be able to play with the editing tools.

[dyvach]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-22-01 AT 02:38PM (EST)[p]>[..]those big red/green arrows spoil the realism of the sim.

Turn off "Onscreen Help" in Driver settings to hide them.

>Can the controls be operated by mouse? Can't seem to get them to move. [..]
>Now speed...Hmmm...The demo gets up to speed almost instantly and stops even quicker. This is
>very unrealistic and disappointing, however I hacked into the engine files and was able, by
>setting the RESISTANCE parameter from it's default 0.95 to a lower value. Play with this
>and see what you get.

Again in Driver settings, switch to "Cabin" control method. This enables cab controls, and removes model-like physics without any hacking. (I'm starting to think Auran should have this mode selected by default, or at least make in really stand out on the Settings screen... :) )

[Boweavel]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-22-01 AT 02:41PM (EST)[p]Vince.. I mean this in no offence.. but trainz isnt a Sim.. Its a Model railway Sim yes..But not a real life sim. The reason they speed up and slow down so fast is because its designed to act just like as electric train would on a model layout. :-)

Yes you can use the mouse controls..but unless you have a super computer you'll probably end up with some chuggyness that makes it unberable to try and get the mouse pointer just right..But it can be done tho :-)

Glad you enjoy the editors..I cant seem to get out of them :P

Catchya's

Edited this just to note that Dyvach must be lurking like me :-) If you select Cabin controls you will have total realism and no DCC..and Vice versa...

Enjoy

[BNSF4723]

I'm thinking of waiting for the 4 hours for the demo to download on my crappy 56K but first I need to know a couple of things:

1. Since you can't save in Surveyor mode, can you even drive on the route you created?

2. Is the sound for the trainz more like a buzzing or real-life engine sound?

3. How much and where will I be able to purchase it in Canada?


Thanx a bunch,

Matt
StL&H Hamilton Sub- 25% Done! Holding at 25% to do some research.

[akochan]

>I'm thinking of waiting for the
>4 hours for the demo
>to download on my crappy
>56K but first I need
>to know a couple of
>things:

Geez you must live in Saskatchewan or something... they /do/ have cable and DSL internet in Canada :P

>1. Since you can't save in
>Surveyor mode, can you even
>drive on the route you
>created?

No, it's only a demo to show you how easy and fun route editing can be.

>2. Is the sound for the
>trainz more like a buzzing
>or real-life engine sound?

Somewhere inbetween, like real model trains with DCC sound.

>3. How much and where will
>I be able to purchase
>it in Canada?
>

It will be on normal retail shelfs early in 2002, possibly even Jan or Feb, and be published by Strategy First and will be about $50 American which translates to $6245 Canadian. :P

>Thanx a bunch,
>
>Matt
>StL&H Hamilton Sub- 25% Done! Holding
>at 25% to do some
>research.

-Andy
akochan@crosswinds.net

[Boweavel]

DCC sound? Wheres the DCC sound ? I use it all the time and hear nothing but the Starter motor turning over into a massive rumble and roar :P

What are these DCC sounds you speak of ? :-)

Catchya

[CajunRon]

I downloaded the demo and tried it out. I'm only going to say one thing...Trainz has really made me see MSTS in a totally different light. I now have a much greater appreciate for what I got from Kuju/Microsoft.

[BNSF4723]

>I downloaded the demo and tried
>it out. I'm only
>going to say one thing...Trainz
>has really made me see
>MSTS in a totally different
>light. I now have
>a much greater appreciate for
>what I got from Kuju/Microsoft.
>

Amen to that! But I'm sure they'll both have a special place on my HD :-)

As to the answers to my questions...

1. Yes we do have DSL and Cable up here, we go on the internet after taking the canoe out for a seel hunt in the snow :-P

2. So you're saying an EMD SD40-2 would sound like- RRRUMBLE!!! RRRRR.... BZZZZ.....RRRRRR....BZZZZ....

3. I don't think our dollar's that weak.... oh wait.... dooh, that'll be $20, 900 cdn... oh.... :-P


Matt
StL&H Hamilton Sub- 25% Done! Holding at 25% to do some research.

[CajunRon]

In all fairness, I have a Voodoo5 graphics card and I'm sensing from other post that this may be the problem. Trainz wasn't written with us Voodoo owners in mind.

Oh well, maybe if/when I upgrade my graphics card I might be able to see Trainz in a different light.

It does appear that Trainz is definitely simulating model railroading, even with some of it's inherent problems. Like with model railroading, it is very difficult to get a smooth, slooooowwwww start. (Again, perhaps it's the Voodoo)

[Tony_Hilliam]

Hi Ron,

The Voodoo will definitely do funny things to your graphics, but the driving side should work fine. Have you gone onto Cabin mode? Using the keyboard shortcuts you should find a very realistic ride. (Under DC mode, the trains drive like on a model railroad layout)

Also, I believe companies are offering trade-ins on the voodoo5 cards.

[dgauci]

>In all fairness, I have a
>Voodoo5 graphics card and I'm
>sensing from other post that
>this may be the problem.
>Trainz wasn't written with us
>Voodoo owners in mind.

I tried the demo version with a GeForce2 MX 400 64mb card on a very high end system and the graphics were still horrible. I don't think it was your card.

[CeeBee]

Are you knocking his cpu?

[Tony_Hilliam]

>>In all fairness, I have a
>>Voodoo5 graphics card and I'm
>>sensing from other post that
>>this may be the problem.
>>Trainz wasn't written with us
>>Voodoo owners in mind.
>
>I tried the demo version with
>a GeForce2 MX 400 64mb
>card on a very high
>end system and the graphics
>were still horrible. I
>don't think it was your
>card.

I'm trying to understand here if you think the graphics are horrible, or if your card makes them look horrible? Did you get views something like in these links on your system? (i.e. are these the horrible graphics you refer to?)
http://www.auran.com/trainz/screenshotz/images/15_640.jpg
http://www.auran.com/trainz/screenshotz/images/17_640.jpg
http://www.auran.com/trainz/screenshotz/images/18_640.jpg
http://www.auran.com/trainz/screenshotz/images/19_640.jpg
http://www.auran.com/trainz/screenshotz/images/1_640.jpg

[dgauci]

>Are you knocking his cpu?

No, I don't even know what CPU he has. I meant what I said, I don't think his video card is neccesarily to blame if his graphics don't look that good in the demo.

[Velocity]

[hr]I tried the demo version with a GeForce2 MX 400 64mb card on a very high end system and the graphics were still horrible. I don't think it was your card.[hr]

Gee, I wonder what the problem is. You've got a BUDGET card, with an amount of RAM it cannot use effectively, with a smaller amount of memory bandwidth than any of the other geforce2 cards (except the MX200, but MX's are crap, really).

You get what you pay for in terms of performance, and the MX series are pretty poor.

[CeeBee]

ah.... Ic.... i thought you said the graphics were horrible and it sounded like if it wasnt his card it must be something else to do with his system.... Sorry... i guess i misunderstood... However, I sure don't agree with the graphics being horrible, cause they are definitely not horrible on my computer. If you dont believe me, check out my screenshots.
http://persweb.direct.ca/cbarkman/trainz/maininfo.htm

[Boweavel]

I have an mx400 ..trains runs fine for me .

Catchya

[dgauci]

>I'm trying to understand here if
>you think the graphics are
>horrible, or if your card
>makes them look horrible? Did
>you get views something like
>in these links on your
>system? (i.e. are these the
>horrible graphics you refer to?)
>

Yes, those are the views I pretty much am seeing. My comments towards the graphics break down into two areas.

The general scenery looks ok, but to my eye has a subtle feeling of a oil painting to it, rather than a real scene. I prefer the Sky Conductor2 sort of skies for instance. This is pure aesthetics.

The real area I dislike is the complete lack of detail and sharpness in the rolling stock and engines. The boxcar in the demo was very blurry and boxy looking (flat one dimensional surfaces), the engine was not much better. I don't care for the look of the cab interior, it to me had a more aesthetic feel of a painting than a real object. There are many examples of what I consider very good cabs to contrast it against, 3DTrains for instance.

The hardware I'm using should not be limiting the demo at all.

Dell Dimension PIII 1ghz
Dell P990 19" Triniton monitor
Windows XP Professional
768mb ECC Ram
GeForce2 MX400 64mb / Nvidia 23.11
130gb 7200 rpm ATA/100 HD
Promise ATA/100 Card

[dgauci]

I'm not complaining about the performance of my video card, which is pretty good actually in everything I use it for.

[decry]

hehe! grow up kids

[VRfan]

I've got an ASUS GeForce 2 MX 32mb card and it works extremely well for me. I haven't found a game yet that really pushes this card. I think the GeForce 2 MX cards are excellent value for money.

--

http://members.optushome.com.au/jrbrook/pics/icon.jpg

Victorian Railfan Web Site:
http://www.railpage.org.au/vr/

[Tony_Hilliam]

Thanks for your feedback Dennis. As I have said previously, Trainz is a long term project, and this release is just the first stage. Many of the initial design decisons have been made to balance between performance and aesthetics. For example, the cabs in Trainz are full 3D environments that you can pan around in any direction. The trade-off is that texture resolution is lower than a pre-rendered scene (check out our BB1500 cab for MSTS as an example).

It is interesting that you comment about the skybox as this is one of the key features in Trainz Surveyor. You can set the sky colour throughout the day and choose from a wide variety of skies (from clear blue to very cloudy). You can also make your own sky in any type of paint program. Similarly, you can set the weather to change dynamically, and this also adds to the overall atmosphere.This functionality is withheld in the Demo version.

Finally, in regard to detail, we have balanced texture resolution and the detail level (number of polygons) against the need to run on as many systems as possible. As the ground textures are overlapped (a process called multi-pass texturing), you get a huge variety of different appearances in the landscape. The trade off is that textures on the default loco's are low resolution. In hindsight, the Rock Island loco is probably a poor choice to go into the Demo as it is not as detailed as some other locos. However, I am sure that you will see some very high quality textures shortly.

Here are a couple of 3rd party examples in the first week:

From Train Artisan: http://www.inevitable.com/TA/files/TrainArtisan_ese015.jpg

From 3DTrains:
http://www.3dtrains.com/screens/trainz01.jpg

Plus one more from gamespot:

http://gamespot.com/gamespot/images/2001/pcnews/110101/trainz/trainz_screen004.jpg

If you have any other constructive feedback, I can assure you it is greatfully accepted.

Tony

[CeeBee]

I have the exact same card and both MSTS and Trainz run very good for me.

[Boweavel]

Bump :)