First impressions of Run8

[Bobsk8]

Okay without reading anything else in this thread since I last looked, First Impressions as a paying customer - no other agenda!

Install went easily enough but game wouldn't run. A passive check of the Run8 forum revealed this likely to be because I hadn't installed the XNA framework. Sure enough, found that and after installing able to get Run 8. A minor hurdle but given this is a retail product, would have been better if the installer checked the user's system for XNA and offer to install if not found.

Front end menu, well... This is not a very good shopfront at all for the product. As noted elsewhere the manual/help screens have not yet been written. To start a run in SP mode there's a list of train headcodes (to use the UK terminology) on the RHS of the screen, but no description as to what the trains are in terms of power, consist or starting location. I happen to know that the BKDOU (or similar) is the loaded oil tanks from Bakersfield over to Mojave which seemed a good place to start.

After poring over the keyboard instructions posted here I eventually grasped that I needed to move towards the train in freeview mode and select the lead engine to get on board. Up pops a menu with various parameters, I opted for quick start and quick handbrake release. Ctrl-F11 is not exactly mnenomic to get in the cab, but once aboard and set the switches and breakers as described in the forums, there was a nagging EOT message on the MFD. This meant getting off the loco and "walking" (quick travel didn't work) to the rear of the train to set the EOT. Once that was done Ctrl-F11 put me back in the front cab and we're off to Mojave - or so I thought.

At this point a word about the Despatcher screen. It is beautifully designed and a credit to the artist but... the most important functionality - interlocking - appears non-existent. I was able to clear signals in opposite directions which would have caused a collision, I was able to clear signals with points set against them and able to move points while the signal was cleared over them. I also noticed passage of the train was not putting signals back to red behind it. So never mind the kiddies getting in a MMO session and causing havoc, it would be quite easy for whoever is acting as despatcher to overlook something and with no interlocking cause a collision or derailment.

Meanwhile back on the "high iron", chugging along merrily, progress did not exactly seem very gainful, the 1% grade up to Sandcut having reduced speed to around 18 MPH. On a hunch, I called up the DPU screen on the MFD to see if the locos behind mine were working but nothing shown. So it appears (correct me if I'm wrong) on the train prep you need to individually start each loco? Also appears you need to nominate the lead DPU but should that be the loco behind the head end unit or the first mid-train? I know, I'll RTFM - oh dear, there isn't one.

In order to do this I had stopped the train. Following the procedure detailed in one of the text documents I applied Notch 2, released the brakes and promptly started to roll back. Obviously still not got all the locos powering so I went to apply the brakes (which BTW I'm assuming are self lapped positional rather than set and lap) to find there was no pressure in the system, the compressor running was not recharging the main res - eek... runaway!

At this point I did a Casey Jones and jumped to drive another day, i.e. exited the programme.

BTW the Save function is undocumented and only found after scrutinising the Run 8 forum.

Anyhow in conclusion. I actually think Run 8 has great potential but it has tremondous wrinkles and strikes me as still being a work in progress. This should never have been put out in such a raw state and needed a couple of months extra to tidy things up, put a decent front end on it and write up some decent documentation. It is definitely a product for the hardcore simmer. Anyone coming straight from driving a Class 166 turbo in Railworks is going to be in for a massive shock. The learning curve is almost vertical. Run 8 would benefit from a proper structured tutorial and in addition to Tehachapi maybe they should have included a shorter, flat route where noobs could cut their teeth on basic train handling before attempting to traverse the mountains. I think it is worth persevering with but it needs tidying up by the developer fairly quickly and the lack of interlocking on the signalling is a major bug that shouldn't have made it through beta.

Sounds to me like this program had a few hours at the most, of beta testing prior to it's release, if even that much. Any beta tester worth his salt would have never OK'd the release of such buggy software, in my opinion. I guess that is why they put that "No Refund" no matter what statement under the credit card Logo's.

[Bobsk8]

Correct. MP doesn't interest me and until I'm more proficient in terms of train handling little point joining a session.

Quick word about graphics and sounds. The graphics are fairly basic but like Bruce I was so focused on train operation I wasn't taking too much notice. Besides, I have always regarded graphics in a train sim as secondary to the overall experience so no points deducted in that respect. Sounds. Well definitely better than Railworks though in cab the engine roar is (accurately) muffled. Personally I didn't think that much of track sound. Not much audible in the cab and going through points and crossings, better than the default RW tin-can rattle but not as meaty as crossing junctions in Trainz.

Having ridden trains for years and years on a daily basis growing up, I think the crossing junction sounds that Trainz gets are the most realistic I have heard.

[NorthernWarrior]

Bruce - as you seem to be one of the few TS.com gang to make it over the pass in one piece any chance you could share...
1. How you ensure all locos are running, i.e. does each one have to be started individually.
2. Where you assign the first DPU loco.
3. Which train you used as DOBKU is obviously one of the more challenging ones. I still feel guilty about bailing out and leaving the train to light up Bakersfield like an, erm, oil fire!

[Train-a-Mania]

1. How you ensure all locos are running, i.e. does each one have to be started individually.
2. Where you assign the first DPU loco.
3. Which train you used as DOBKU is obviously one of the more challenging ones. I still feel guilty about bailing out and leaving the train to light up Bakersfield like an, erm, oil fire!

1. In the locomotive menu, click "Auto-start all locomotives" and "Auto MU All locomotives":

http://run8studios.com/basics4.shtml

2. Click on the first locomotive of a DPU lash-up. Click "DPU Lead Unit". If the locomotive is facing backwards, hit the REV button. Do this for any other sets of DPUs, but only for the first (or single) unit.

3. Q-STOCHI is an easy train to handle.

I agree with your earlier points, and I would definitely recommend posting them in the "suggestions" thread of the Run 8 forums. However...

At this point a word about the Despatcher screen. It is beautifully designed and a credit to the artist but... the most important functionality - interlocking - appears non-existent. I was able to clear signals in opposite directions which would have caused a collision, I was able to clear signals with points set against them and able to move points while the signal was cleared over them. I also noticed passage of the train was not putting signals back to red behind it. So never mind the kiddies getting in a MMO session and causing havoc, it would be quite easy for whoever is acting as despatcher to overlook something and with no interlocking cause a collision or derailment.

CTC boards to not show what a signal indication is. If a signal has been cleared, but there is a train in the following block or the switches are set against it, that signal will display red.

Meanwhile back on the "high iron", chugging along merrily, progress did not exactly seem very gainful, the 1% grade up to Sandcut having reduced speed to around 18 MPH. On a hunch, I called up the DPU screen on the MFD to see if the locos behind mine were working but nothing shown. So it appears (correct me if I'm wrong) on the train prep you need to individually start each loco? Also appears you need to nominate the lead DPU but should that be the loco behind the head end unit or the first mid-train? I know, I'll RTFM - oh dear, there isn't one.

If you have set up the DPU's correctly, you will see them on the MFD when you hit the "B" key. If not, make sure you've set them up correctly.

In order to do this I had stopped the train. Following the procedure detailed in one of the text documents I applied Notch 2, released the brakes and promptly started to roll back. Obviously still not got all the locos powering so I went to apply the brakes (which BTW I'm assuming are self lapped positional rather than set and lap) to find there was no pressure in the system, the compressor running was not recharging the main res - eek... runaway!

There is a "Parking Brake" feature which applies the handbrake on every car of the train. Shift + F5 applies it, F5 releases it.

Thanks for that Vern. I think I'll hold off till the wrinkles are ironed out. You haven't mentioned the MP in any detail (is it easy to find other users or do you quite literally have to organise it by long hand on a forum first)

On the Run 8 forums, there are quite a few people hosting sessions.

[kevhead]

Hey northern warrior I am glad you tried run 8. I think you will like it. I to am testing my skills on it and find it exhilarating and very fun. Remember folks they are still working on it and will soon be doing a free update. I don't ever think I have ever been so involved in a game so much since left4 dead2. LOL. You have to know how to run a real train to succeed in this simulator. Real engineers start trains on steep hills ever day so, school up guys and hope to one day see you track side.

[NorthernWarrior]

Thanks Nick. It is becoming clearer. I presume the locos immediately behind the lead engine are in multiple anyway and therefore don't need to be set as DPU?

[flarrfan2]

Bruce - as you seem to be one of the few TS.com gang to make it over the pass in one piece any chance you could share...
1. How you ensure all locos are running, i.e. does each one have to be started individually.
2. Where you assign the first DPU loco.
3. Which train you used as DOBKU is obviously one of the more challenging ones. I still feel guilty about bailing out and leaving the train to light up Bakersfield like an, erm, oil fire!

Lots of train game lessons to unlearn, I found that out quickly. I have run the 6K' Q-STOCHI from Bak to Bar, and the fully loaded grain train with DPU from Bar to Bak without any errors. It helps that I know the line well from repeated MSTS practice over the last two months, but the performance of the trains is so much more realistic that the second-biggest task with Run8 (after the three hours it took me to figure out how to start and run a train) is forgetting everything you thought you knew about driving a train from MSTS, RW or any other game out there.

[flarrfan2]

Thanks Nick. It is becoming clearer. I presume the locos immediately behind the lead engine are in multiple anyway and therefore don't need to be set as DPU?

Correct...click on the lead unit, auto start all engines, MU all engines, find the DPU power (there's a tank train with midtrain and rear end DPUs), click the lead unit, make sure to get the fwd/rev direction right so it doesn't pull against the lead units, put the EOT on the back, ctrl F11 back to the cab, throw all the switches, release the handbrakes, take the appropriate actions based on the grade you're starting from, and go.

There's also a way to see cars and other non-moving trains in yards and across the route in free-agent roam. Choose one of the pre-arranged sessions from the Options menu, find a train (or put one together) and run it. As to the CTC board, if you are by yourself, you need to set your own signals and switches. To make it work properly, you need to be in full screen mode (F4). I'm playng around right now and forgot to set the signals, so stopped at the first red and set the route all the way from Cameron to Bakersfield. Hope this helps.

[spec5sx]

Why is that post even constructive?

People were banned because they got three strikes or had a personal feud. No one was banned without three strikes or got mouthy about the ban with the moderator.

Who cares whether you are going to buy Run8? Your signature sums up your feelings.

Harold

I got banned for none of theses reasons.

[Bobsk8]

I got banned for none of theses reasons.

Looks like Run 8 is a pretty good simulation of "arrogance".....