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Thread: TSW feedback to DTG

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by geepster775 View Post
    A counter approach to that is only develop the platform, and let each locale generate their content. If there are plenty of people in one geographic location, content options will be strong. If there are fewer users in Japan, then I can see why content would be limited. Let the free market handle things in each locale, and rely less on 'Uncle Sugar' to forcibly supply you with distant content.

    This platform has not shaken itself loose from any need to provide a universally-palatable menu of content.
    Well as "Uncle Sugar" is a UK company when are you going to start......
    Geoff
    Dorset - near The Swanage Railway.
    UK

  2. #22
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    Depending on the route tools included with the new TSW, I'm sure the many talented people out there will get the ball rolling for new rolling stock and routes. Again, hoping the resources are available.

    Here in the USA, This is our Uncle Sugar.
    http://www.barrypopik.com/index.php/...am_sugar_daddy
    Interested in all Train-Sims

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by dejoh View Post
    Depending on the route tools included with the new TSW, I'm sure the many talented people out there will get the ball rolling for new rolling stock and routes. Again, hoping the resources are available.
    .....and not holding your breath on that I hope?

    Quote Originally Posted by dejoh View Post
    Here in the USA, This is our Uncle Sugar.
    http://www.barrypopik.com/index.php/...am_sugar_daddy
    Errr ...YEP we got that. I was being ironic Get's ya every time Huh?
    Geoff
    Dorset - near The Swanage Railway.
    UK

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by seagoon View Post
    Steve,
    I think that it's possible....maybe even probable....that many died-in-the-wool train-simmers in Britain and Europe may not contemplate buying TSW until there is local content.

    Several of our correspondents on here, and other forums, have already stated that until relative content for their particular country and area of interest is available, they won't obtain the base game, which is understandable to you and me, but, I think DTG have dropped the ball on their marketing predictions for worldwide sales, which isn't very good, really.

    (Say what you will about Microsoft but they did get the content right with the initial release of MSTS all those years ago; they had something for every major market - USA, Europe, Britain and Japan.)

    And that is why I, and many others, are left scratching our heads with DTG, as to why they have decided to go down this route of only 1 layout in 1 country to be made available on the first day of release for the whole world, utterly bizarre.......

    In my opinion (based in part on about a decade associated with and working in the computer games retail sector, 1990 - 2001) the world-wide market for TSW & Sandpatch will be quite reasonable because the means of promotion & delivery has changed.

    Unsure what you quite mean there Bruce, however, I agree that the majority of Railfans everywhere will have heard of the famous Sandpatch Grade and as we haven't had it built in Railworks/TS20xx, I think it is an excellent choice of route, and I'm sure it will be a winner with many fans.

    If TSW gets off to a round of applause from the trade media and personal reviewers on Steam then irrespective of whether it has one North American route or not, it should at least establish a solid foundation on which to build international routes and content.

    I guess we wait and see.

    If, if, if...... I agree with your sentiments, Bruce, let's hope DTG put it all into practice.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sly View Post
    Note I did say Owners and not users,

    I appreciate that Paul, I know that we didn't get the game registered on the Steam Software website until December 2009, I cannot find the online details now of how many folks have actually registered any of the Railworks / Train Sim versions over this length of time, I'm sure it got to about 250,000 +, but, that was a year, or, two ago, and obviously things have changed as folks have moved away from the game with real life committments, etc, etc.

    Further to back up my point, my own little pre alpha demo that I put on general release (quietly on Youtube) has 1k+ DL in 2 days.
    50K owners for TSW in year one would be a reasonable target both in terms of return - circa 1m, and achievability - 10% of RW owners
    Likely that you will eventually finish up with seperate products for the 3 main user bases. (which may later be brought together)
    So 15k users for each will get them pretty close to that 50k target.

    Yes, I watched your videos when they were first released and could see the potential that was possible, especially, for a man of your exceptional talent, and I'm sure you and possibly some other British 3rd party developers will do all you can to fill in the void of any UK routes and appropriate working models with all the bells and whistles attached.

    All conjecture of course, my point being that the market is there and DTG has a pretty good record at getting stuff off the shelves.

    Everything stated on here is speculation and postulation, but, DTG have never filled me loads of confidence Paul, since Day 1, and that's what worries me the most.
    Quote Originally Posted by geepster775 View Post
    A counter approach to that is only develop the platform, and let each locale generate their content. If there are plenty of people in one geographic location, content options will be strong.
    That's exactly what happened in the Trainz game franchise over the years, unsure if you have ever played that game, but, their management provided the base game and then let everyone do their own thing. To be fair to DTG, at least they have provided some content, routes and locomotives and everything to start people off with in the base game versions, and we then had fans from across the globe making content from their own countries, which has been widely accepted, hopefully, DTG will provide the tools for talented folks to create their own content for TSW CSX Heavy Haul to put in the Steam Workshop, etc, etc. As I stated elsewhere, it all depends on the EULA and any licencing issues that might crop up, BNSF being a classic example, we don't know what DTG are currently emboiled with, or, if they are going to restrict the community on what can be built and what can't, we'll just have to wait and see.

    Cheerz. Steve.
    i5 4690 3.5 GHz Quad Core CPU, Gigabyte Z97-HD3, 16GB RAM, nVidia GTX1060 6GB, WIN 7 PRO 64-bit.

  5. #25
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    Have you become a Greenie, Steve?

    What I meant was that sixteen and more years ago there was very little software (of any description) being sold via downloading.
    Broadband was non-existent, internet speeds were abysmally-slow in comparison to the speed now, Steam didn't exist, games were mostly retailed in boxes over the counter and promotion and marketing was predominantly via printed publications and in-store posters/brochures and discussions with the sales people.
    So there was far less "community influence" on someone deciding whether to buy a game or not because the community itself was not as connected as it is today.

    Now it is completely different, with the vast majority of marketing, retailing and discussion being done online.
    IBM XT i386; 512Kb RAM; 5.25" FDD; 1.4Mb FDD; 5Mb HDD; VGA 256-colour graphics card; AdLib soundcard; DR DOS 6.0; Windows 3.0

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by seagoon View Post


    Broadband was non-existent, internet speeds were abysmally-slow in comparison to the speed now, Steam didn't exist
    Maybe the question is...... will STEAM exist in another 10 years ?

    My own view (only) is that it has past its high point and the decline has begun.
    Used to be a high proportion of "Class" titles nowadays (much like DTG DLC) it has become swamped in a morass of mediocre offerings that is doing little to promote PC gaming.

    Valve has just announced a Pay to Publish program, whereby any dev can pay $XXXX and get their game on STEAM.
    (as opposed to getting enough votes on the Greenlight system)

    The official line is that it will hopefully improve quality, my own opinion is it to max revenue whilst the going is still good / reasonable.

    Valve's Opposition ?

    Pay to play gaming....... instant availability and with ever increasing network speeds becomes more and more viable and appealing in this have credit card want it now world.

    Benefits for developers / publishers.

    Stability and reliability, instant payment, multi platform, usage data, Nil piracy.

    Downsides for enthusiast users
    Req online,
    Editors Unlikely/difficult
    ( you could have the scenario whereby somebody made a "Map" (route) and offered it to the publisher.
    who then incorporated it into the Master/ Regional software.)

    You may soon be looking back on the good old ddays of RW when you could make what you want and sell / give it away as you wished.

    Progress a double edged sword

    Sly

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sly View Post
    You may soon be looking back on the good old ddays of RW when you could make what you want and sell / give it away as you wished.
    Exactly the reason that I held onto a couple of older laptops (W98 and WXP) so that I can play some games which still hold their appeal and do not require any internet connection....they are totally stand-alone.

    And I will do the same with the games that I enjoy now and which can be played solo and off the 'net....MSTS/Open Rails is one, Train Simulator another, as is Run 8, Flight Sim (pre-Steam) yet another, plus several RTS games and a couple of motor-racing sims.

    Like many others of our vintage, I don't need multiplayer games in order to be entertained for an hour or so. Interaction with other humans is a real-life activity as far as I'm concerned. Computer gaming is the same as reading a book for me; a solo activity.
    Last edited by seagoon; 02-15-2017 at 07:39 PM.
    IBM XT i386; 512Kb RAM; 5.25" FDD; 1.4Mb FDD; 5Mb HDD; VGA 256-colour graphics card; AdLib soundcard; DR DOS 6.0; Windows 3.0

  8. #28
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    Pay to play gaming....... instant availability and with ever increasing network speeds becomes more and more viable and appealing in this have credit card want it now world.
    N3V have already indicated some sort of subscription model is intended for their "Next" version of Trainz. At present this will be to access servers for co-operative route building but would not be a long stretch to extend this further. Building a route in Surveyor? Well you only get 5km of "free" track splines per day, unless you pay extra. The Clash Of Clans style business model, while it may seem unethical and grossly expensive (80 for an in game currency pack!) is nevertheless obviously quite successful for those running that type of game. I'm pleased to say I have never succumbed to the temptation and just "grind" but my missus has dropped the odd 5 here and there on the iOS versions of Sim City and The Simpsons game.


    I too have enough "old" games to serve my needs if Steam etc. went belly up but by the other side of the coin I also have an extended collection of titles which depend on Steam, not just train sim stuff but Fallout 3 -NV - 4, Dirt Rally etc. etc. which would be more of a loss personally than good old TS2017.
    Vern.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sly View Post
    ...Maybe the question is...... will STEAM exist in another 10 years ?...Sly
    Maybe the questions is... will I exist in another 10 years!

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot_Box_Detector View Post
    Maybe the questions is... will I exist in another 10 years!
    There's a few of us on here that are pondering that!
    Geoff
    Dorset - near The Swanage Railway.
    UK

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