Originally posted by Mark_Blum
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Originally posted by glcbn View PostDid everything right and received no better than 50%,oh well.
After playing this one again I'll offer up some more thoughts:
The ability to simulate different forms of interlocking machines is important. The interlocking machine used in the demo is good for a generic tower (I believe most PRR interlockings used that setup or similar), but what about an "Armstrong" machine like the one used at HO Tower in Hancock? It would be nice to have different interlocking machines simulated to provide for a more authentic feel.
There needs to be a greater delay in the time it takes from when a stopped train is given a signal to when the train actually passes the tower. When I cleared the eastbound freight to run behind the Broadway Limited, it passed the tower within a minute of the signal being lined. Even for a train running downhill there needs to be a delay of a couple minutes or so to allow for the brakes to release, and then even more time for the train to get up to track speed. Additionally, there should be additional time kept in memory after a track exits the block after the tower in the model board. I cleared the eastbound freight to move right after the Broadway's light disappeared from the board, and I got a medium clear signal. Since the Broadway would have still been in the second block from the tower at this time, a medium approach signal should have been given here instead since the next block would have been occupied. Perhaps the sim should take into account the additional 2-3 minutes from when the train exits the board (in other words, when it clears the first block) to when it clears the next block ahead and display signal indications accordingly. Additionally, limited, medium, and slow speed turnouts should be taken into account, with signal speeds displaying the speed at which a train may pass over the turnouts.
The sound is good. Most of the tower sounds I'm hearing sound realistic (the radio chatter does sound monotonous after a while though, perhaps it would be best to eliminate that and just use the phone ringing sound). The train sounds are all very good, and I like how they can easily be customized. The sound of a couple of 645 powered SD40s on the westbound manifest made me feel like I was actually there (although for a heavy westbound there should have been a set of helper engines pushing at the rear). I agree with the others that the view displayed gets boring after a while, and I don't think visually adding trains would do much to fix that. Maybe providing for a couple of different views inside the tower would be nice, even if they don't show trains or the "magazines" jhilden2 mentioned. Also, for larger towers if would be necessary to "scroll" through the model board and levers for all of them to be displayed. The one benefit I could see for showing trains outside the tower would be for the purpose of inspecting them. Operators would give trains a "roll-by" as they passed the tower and would report any defects they spotted.
Although it's important for the game to have a realistic feel, I also feel that it would be nice to have the ability to jump ahead several minutes if there's a gap in traffic. Although the demo sim kept me busy for the entire 15 minutes, for a full length sim it's a given that there will be some dead areas. I'm sure the operator would use this dead time to eat lunch, read train sheets, and maybe contact the dispatcher for info on upcoming trains, but for the sake of this simulation it would be better if the dead times were skipped.
What about paperwork? In addition to the block phone, I believe operators are required to keep a written record of trains passing their tower. This may be a little difficult to duplicate in a computer simulation (not to mention monotonous), if done correctly it could make things much more realistic and challenging. Also, train orders would need to be filled out for trains operating in "dark" territory, work limits, against the current of traffic on directional trackage, among other things.
Another thing that should be considered is the constant revisions of interlockings. Although MG was open from 1944 to 1994, the sim is only accurate from the opening year to when Conrail removed the fourth track here in the early 1980s. Although this is the only change I know of for MG, for larger interlockings there would generally be numerous revisions to the track alignment over the course of the tower's lifespan. Generally removed track would simply be taped over with relevant levers removed or blocked over. Although it wouldn't be necessary to cover every revision in the working life of a tower, for some of the more complex arrangements it may be better to include two or three different versions of the tower covering different eras (allowing for maximum flexibility in the creation of activities).
In all, I'm impressed with the capabilities of the sim. If done correctly and with the right tower, I could find this game very enjoyable and bordering on addictive (something MSTS always lacked for me).
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Greg,
Are you remembering to OS the trains past MG by calling the dispatcher as soon as the red light goes out on the model board? I've run the demo several times now and each time I receive 100% with a message about being promoted to upper management within no time.
I agree, the garbled dispatcher voice is something that can be eliminated in my opinion, the sim already displays the message at the top of the screen.sigpic
Rich S.
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Hi Everyone,
Thanks for the replies regarding Tower Sim. I want to point out that MG Tower is only the first release, and was chosen for it's relative simplicity to determine level of interest in such products. More complicated track arrangements, as well as all-relay, mechanical, and NX type interlocking machines are planned for future releases.
Sure, we would love to have an all-3d simulator as well, but that is a long term goal, as opposed to a short term reality. A 3d simulator would require a larger dev team than we have, not to mention developers with the 3d development skills, which none of us currently possess. In the meantime, I would like to continue exploring the cut scene option without the scenario file size exploding through the roof. One of the options we have at our disposal is the internet. The external audio/files can be opened from a local folder, as present in the demo. Alternatively, they can be loaded from a web URL as a streaming audio/video object. For "out of the box" compatibility, local access to the files makes the most sense, however, user generated activities would allow for either method.
The key is to find a compression ratio and window size for video to allow for watching all or most of a train go by without massive file sizes. At the moment, a 60 second, 400K Flash Video, at 400x300 resolution, generates a file about 3.7 megs in size. If you have 30 such files, you then have one scenario over 100 megs. Not really practical. You could, however, load these files from a web URL. As I said before, I would like to see all audio/video files shipping with the finished product hosted on the local machine. However, using the internet as part of the game would add a great deal of flexibility.
We are seeing more and more games today requiring and active internet connection while the game runs. With that in mind, here is a question for the community. What if the finished product used the internet to stream audio and video files while you were running the game?
Thanks,
Jason@SLI
PS. For those who are wondering, the garbled telephone voice is just to simulate a voice, which isn't really saying anything. Some of you have mentioned that you don't even feel it's necessary, and I tend to agree. Perhaps its something to remove in the final release.
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Originally posted by NorthShore_364 View PostDid you report the trains past the tower after they passed (the dispatcher phone)? You'll have points deducted if you don't within a minute of the train's passage.
After playing this one again I'll offer up some more thoughts:
The ability to simulate different forms of interlocking machines is important. The interlocking machine used in the demo is good for a generic tower (I believe most PRR interlockings used that setup or similar), but what about an "Armstrong" machine like the one used at HO Tower in Hancock? It would be nice to have different interlocking machines simulated to provide for a more authentic feel.
There needs to be a greater delay in the time it takes from when a stopped train is given a signal to when the train actually passes the tower. When I cleared the eastbound freight to run behind the Broadway Limited, it passed the tower within a minute of the signal being lined. Even for a train running downhill there needs to be a delay of a couple minutes or so to allow for the brakes to release, and then even more time for the train to get up to track speed. Additionally, there should be additional time kept in memory after a track exits the block after the tower in the model board. I cleared the eastbound freight to move right after the Broadway's light disappeared from the board, and I got a medium clear signal. Since the Broadway would have still been in the second block from the tower at this time, a medium approach signal should have been given here instead since the next block would have been occupied. Perhaps the sim should take into account the additional 2-3 minutes from when the train exits the board (in other words, when it clears the first block) to when it clears the next block ahead and display signal indications accordingly. Additionally, limited, medium, and slow speed turnouts should be taken into account, with signal speeds displaying the speed at which a train may pass over the turnouts.
The sound is good. Most of the tower sounds I'm hearing sound realistic (the radio chatter does sound monotonous after a while though, perhaps it would be best to eliminate that and just use the phone ringing sound). The train sounds are all very good, and I like how they can easily be customized. The sound of a couple of 645 powered SD40s on the westbound manifest made me feel like I was actually there (although for a heavy westbound there should have been a set of helper engines pushing at the rear). I agree with the others that the view displayed gets boring after a while, and I don't think visually adding trains would do much to fix that. Maybe providing for a couple of different views inside the tower would be nice, even if they don't show trains or the "magazines" jhilden2 mentioned. Also, for larger towers if would be necessary to "scroll" through the model board and levers for all of them to be displayed. The one benefit I could see for showing trains outside the tower would be for the purpose of inspecting them. Operators would give trains a "roll-by" as they passed the tower and would report any defects they spotted.
Although it's important for the game to have a realistic feel, I also feel that it would be nice to have the ability to jump ahead several minutes if there's a gap in traffic. Although the demo sim kept me busy for the entire 15 minutes, for a full length sim it's a given that there will be some dead areas. I'm sure the operator would use this dead time to eat lunch, read train sheets, and maybe contact the dispatcher for info on upcoming trains, but for the sake of this simulation it would be better if the dead times were skipped.
What about paperwork? In addition to the block phone, I believe operators are required to keep a written record of trains passing their tower. This may be a little difficult to duplicate in a computer simulation (not to mention monotonous), if done correctly it could make things much more realistic and challenging. Also, train orders would need to be filled out for trains operating in "dark" territory, work limits, against the current of traffic on directional trackage, among other things.
Another thing that should be considered is the constant revisions of interlockings. Although MG was open from 1944 to 1994, the sim is only accurate from the opening year to when Conrail removed the fourth track here in the early 1980s. Although this is the only change I know of for MG, for larger interlockings there would generally be numerous revisions to the track alignment over the course of the tower's lifespan. Generally removed track would simply be taped over with relevant levers removed or blocked over. Although it wouldn't be necessary to cover every revision in the working life of a tower, for some of the more complex arrangements it may be better to include two or three different versions of the tower covering different eras (allowing for maximum flexibility in the creation of activities).
In all, I'm impressed with the capabilities of the sim. If done correctly and with the right tower, I could find this game very enjoyable and bordering on addictive (something MSTS always lacked for me).
Great comments Austin! Thanks for your thoughts. At the moment, there is a lag time to when the train gets started past the signal. You are correct about increasing them. When trains are directed into track against the current of traffic, they will move at restricted speed, and slightly less if going uphill. Otherwise, downhill trains run at 25 mph for freight and 35 for passenger. Uphill, is a percentage of those speeds based on the type of train.
Regards,
Jason@SLI
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lelandfletcher
Dear Friends,
Yes, I've tried it. It is confusing at first, unless one all ready knows how this type of historic system works.
I've had years of experience with the sim, Train Dispatcher3 by Signal, so I had a bit of knowledge. The comparison to Train Dispatcher 3 is natural. It is the closest Sim to Tower.
After awhile, I did get to 100% completion score.
Then I downloaded the instructions to create scenarios and after trial and error, created a 19 minute scenario with 5 trains (It seems this is MAX time and trains for the demo). I've gotten to 100% on that also.
Some suggestioon to improve Tower:
It is set in real time ( 1 Min = 1 Min ), so there is waiting time between a flurry of activity.
The trains are only identified by written instructions which disappear when a new instruction comes in. This can lead to confusion as to which train is which for routing the turnouts. i.e., does the yellow approach light signal the end of the first train or the arrival of the new train? Could the instructions stay posted in a short sequence?
There is no pause, when minimized the sim keeps running. I would like to see an automatic pause when minimized.
Possibly some paperwork to do during the waiting periods would add to the sim. To differentiate Tower from TD3 there needs to be other duties inherent to the tower operator to make this Sim different.
I like the simplicity and ability to play on any computer, anytime. For that reason I would say no to the Internet.
All in all it is a good glimpse into the historic past.
Yours truly,
Leland
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I would rather see Seligman phase 2 finished and delivered than SLI go off on yet another tangent
Processor: Intel 13th Gen i5-13400F, - Mobo: MSI PRO Z790-P, - OS: Win 11 Prof 64bit. - Memory: Corsair Vengeance 64GB Ram, - Graphics MSI RTX 4060 Ventus 2x Black OC 8GB, - Sound: Asus STRIX SOAR Gaming Soundcard, - Storage: 7TB SSD's. - Case: BeQuiet! Pure Base 500 Black.
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who is that dispatcher?
PS. For those who are wondering, the garbled telephone voice is just to simulate a voice, which isn't really saying anything. Some of you have mentioned that you don't even feel it's necessary, and I tend to agree. Perhaps its something to remove in the final release.
I believe you guys display real talent, Thanks for keeping the trains rollin!
Ray
aka NSdville
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lelandfletcher
Dear Edward K,
Give the "Broadway Limited" the 4L vertical yellow (Green) right away. You know it is coming and has priority.
When the "Broadway Limited" clears the approach block (right yellow disappears), turn off the 4L signal. As soon as the center red dissappears, align switch 1 to Track 2 and turn on 2L signal for the train on Track 1.
2L will then go to vertical yellow (green) automatically as soon as it is allowed. Don't fiddle with it.
Turn on vertical yellow on 6R before or as soon as the Westbound arrives.
Don't forget to notify the next Tower of the approaching train as soon as the center red goes out.
Yours truly,
Leland
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I'll be short and to the point: I like it. I want it.
Itching for more scenarios, to tell you the truth.
Good show, SLI - looking forward to purchasing it.
-KurtLast edited by TrirailF40PHL; 10-01-2009, 08:41.
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Please do realize that nagging and complaining about what SLI hasn't released is not going to make him move any faster, nor release the products in question. I figured ya'll would understand that by now. If this is what Jason thinks is good for his company then so be it. There are other great developers that have released cabs suitable for many engines.
As for the Tower Sim. I like, I would love to see something like Stockton Tower, or 16th Street Tower (Oakland Mole).F. Strong-Baker
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