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    Would like help with adding track nodes

    If a mod would be so kind as to lock my post I had earlier on coupler fix,it's been said that those coupler settings I had are good and are up to date.

    Now,with that set aside,How would I go about adding extra nodes if needed to keep my trains together while running on a route? Only in 2(two) sections do my trains un-couple and well,guess I'll first try to fix them first before the author does. They only un-couple near the start/ending of some switches.

    #2
    I had just commented on this issue at https://www.trainsim.com/vbts/showpo...20&postcount=9

    To repeat that post:

    You do not want more than a few miles of straight track in Microsoft Train Simulator. You will get broken couplers when passing through switches after a long distance between nodes. To avoid this problem either insert switches leading to sidings or insert a pair of zero degree switches as shown at http://www.nklj.se/xtracks/documents/laying.htm

    Inserting a Track Node

    (by Steven Masters) This trick is used to insert a track node in long stretches of single line track. The train position is calculated from the last track node passed. A track node is a switch or crossing and shows like black dots in the Activity Editor. Due to rounding when calculating the trains position there is an error when reaching the next track node which can cause the train to jump. This can be a real problem on routes with long stretches of single line tracks, especially if it contains many curves. To minimize the problem this very short siding track can be inserted to divide the long stretch of track into shorter stretches. Thanks to using two switches there is no risk of derailing as both paths converge again after two meters even if you happen to use the 'G'-key.
    Replace a section of track with another section of track that is 5 meters shorter. Insert two A1tPnt1mStrt switches end to end. These switches will occupy two meters of track on the main path and one meter of track on the diverging path. Insert one A1t1mStrt to close the diverging path and one A1t3mStrt to close the main path.
    Last edited by krausyao; 12-22-2008, 13:10. Reason: typo
    Jeffrey Kraus-Yao
    Digital Rails Corporation
    http://www.digital-rails.us

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by marklester01 View Post
      How would I go about adding extra nodes if needed to keep my trains together while running on a route...
      Here's a six meter long invisible "siding" or long-stretch-breaker. The position of the cursor, at the blue pole closest to the red pole, in step 1 is where you will place the 3 meter straight in step 2.

      If the whole sequence is placed in this fashion, you will not see the "siding" on the Track Monitor unless you press the "G" key on the way to it. Even if you do, you will not notice anything happening as you take the "siding" as you pass through.

      regards,
      charlie

      Attached Files

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        #4
        Also, FWIW/FYI Scalerail has dummy nodes as well: http://steam4me.railpage.org.au/trai...zero_node.html.

        Comment


          #5
          Track modification cautions.

          Mark,

          If the route you plan to modify has interactive objects installed, like signals, speed limits and car spawners you need to take extra precautions before modifying the track or you will destroy the routes databases.

          And Charlie, I do the same thing without the straight section, just two zero degree switches end to end. Less is better!
          Last edited by Vince; 12-19-2008, 19:03.
          ............Vince ..............
          ...... Author NECv4 .......
          .... LIRR BUILD PHOTOS ....
          ...... Eschew Obsfucation ......

          On the The Statue of Liberty in New York Harbor there is a Tablet. On it is written:
          "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
          the wretched refuse of your teeming shore, send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me,
          I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

          Comment


            #6
            As far as I know it is only cross-over nodes missing in stretches of twin-tracks which are longer than 7 miles that could cause de-derailments to inadequately adjusted rolling stock, which has been discussed many times here in this forum a long time ago, Lukas Lusser (Swissie) explaining the reasons for them.

            None of the HUGE routes I run trains in, have created or modified, have ever caused any derailments on long stretches of single or twin-tracks, in fact none at all !

            O t t o
            Web site: www.otto-wipfel.co.uk

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Vince View Post
              And Charlie, I do the same thing without the straight section, just two zero degree switches end to end. Less is better!
              I recommended that configuration because "you will not see the "siding" on the Track Monitor unless you press the "G" key". I did it your way in the early days. It bothered me and some other folks to see an apparently "thrown switch" where none should exist...

              regards,
              charlie

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by OTTODAD View Post
                As far as I know it is only cross-over nodes missing in stretches of twin-tracks which are longer than 7 miles that could cause de-derailments to inadequately adjusted rolling stock, which has been discussed many times here in this forum a long time ago, Lukas Lusser (Swissie) explaining the reasons for them.
                This has nothing to do with derailments, but with uncoupling. It also has nothing to do with double versus single track.

                Further, it has nothing directly to do with the actual unbroken distance between track nodes. It has everything to do with the total number of timesteps it takes to traverse the unbroken distance.

                As far as I recall, this was first intelligently examined by Joseph Realmuto and C. Leveritt in this topic:


                The two ways are identified that "distance down a path" is calculated. Cumulative error in the Runge-Kutta (or Euler) numerical integration gives rise to the repositioning at the far node.

                For those who would like to have a demo of the effect of total number of timesteps, you need to have 3DTS's Donner Pass installed to run the attached activities.

                Both of these use consists installed with the route. For either, just get the train moving and over into Run 8. You need do nothing else but just watch.

                Run "6272 long node" first, a freight with 4 F7's and 26 cars. You can use this one to make sure your couplers are up to it. You can save just before the far node at about 26 minutes.

                "6213 long node" is a freight with just 2 F7's and 34 cars. Use a little sand to start. You might save this one at about 54.5 minutes so that you can watch it many times. It never does exactly the same thing twice...

                regards,
                charlie
                Attached Files

                Comment


                  #9
                  Yup. This was discussed many eons ago by many of the old heads that frequent(ed) this place. The track node issue is geniune. As I recall from my work in this realm, uninterupted straight track was good for about 10 miles. Curvacious track down to about 5 miles. (More cumultive errors to parse for the program in curved sections.)

                  If you want to run semi-realistic coupler values, you'll need a node about every 4 miles in curving territory and about every 9 miles in straight.

                  Andre Ming
                  V Scale Creations
                  Andre Ming
                  V Scale Creations.com R.I.P

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I am having this very issue on the CSX M&M route (original, 3 part download). I was just searching for a way to insert the "zero point node" without destroying the route. Since I've never tried to modify someone elses completed route, I'd be interested in hearing any suggestions.

                    The situation occurs between Intenational Paper Siding and South Greenville, for those familiar with the route. (when South bound, at International Paper siding, and when North bound, at South Greenville siding - total single track distance between two= 16.5 miles+/-).

                    EDIT: Problem solved. Node inserted without issue, and I only had to re-make a few Paths.
                    (If anyone should search for a fix for the M&M <CSX Mobile to Montgomery)>, and find this post, I placed my Node at lat./long. 31.82816/-86.62911. After testing, it does not appear to affect any signals or other interactive objects.)
                    Last edited by kingconrail76; 01-05-2009, 11:43.
                    Steven

                    sigpic

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                      #11
                      Hi Charlie !

                      I was made aware of this problem by this post from Lukas (Swissie) a long time ago: https://www.trainsim.com/vbts/showth...ighlight=nodes

                      Reading it you will notice that he reports a derailment caused by an uncoupled loco, which also happened to me test driving a similar train where he did !

                      First attempt: Desaster hit me! The second of my three SD40s uncoupled, then somewhat stalled, cartwheeled, and needless to say, SD40 No. 3 and 30+ boxes started to pile up behind. All I could do was hit "esc" and duck for cover.

                      That caused me to further experiment: https://www.trainsim.com/vbts/showth...ighlight=nodes

                      My memory not being what it used to be, pushing 80 in two weeks, forgot that I had to use crossover nodes in twin-tracks sections between Shelby and Cutbank, there not having been the selection of XTracks we have now and can use dummy nodes in single tracks !

                      The then WUPPER-EXPRESS had a similar problem and making Rald Kölsche aware of it he then fixed it in the next version.

                      Inserting new switches nodes into existing tracks will of course destroy all the paths of activities player and AI services using them and have to be re-created !

                      I wonder whether many changes in the elevation of the tracks can also stress inadequately set couplers of long and heavy trains to breaking point when driving over such tracks ?

                      Like I said, I have never had any problems with braking couplers in any route since 2003, after strengthening all my rolling stocks couplers, then with ENGMOD and later with the ROUTE RITER, making them all RIGID. Not even where whole trains jump to other tracks because trailing switches in activities are set against them !

                      Adding cross-over nodes into the MARIAS-PASS part of the MARIAS-KOOTENAI, also used by my GOLD-SPIKE route, should benefit others who use slack-action couplers with weaker settings !

                      I hope that this explains better what I am trying to say !

                      O t t o
                      Last edited by OTTODAD; 01-04-2009, 09:30.
                      Web site: www.otto-wipfel.co.uk

                      Comment


                        #12
                        My Big Uncoupling Problem

                        I've tried,I just don't understand it!
                        The route I'm running is the NS Birmnham Route.The author says he's making a "better" version from one point in Al to another in MS by way of TN. Well,will Otto or other good talented "track" people try a run on the NS Birmnham route(with both updates and everything from the RRBackups folder),and you might see/know what I'm talking about?.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          I can not see any twin-tracks in the B/Ham route which could be longer than 7 miles and do not have crossover switches nodes in them and there not being any mile posts I can not tell how long this twin tracks stretch is which goes West from the Westside Scrap Metal area before there are some nodes.

                          Where are you are you running a train, what type and how many cars and where in the route do you get a derailment.

                          Knowing the Compass co-ordinates of that spot would help !

                          Did you say you have been modifying tracks ?

                          O t t o
                          Web site: www.otto-wipfel.co.uk

                          Comment


                            #14
                            No,I've been trying to apply nodes to stop derailments,I've ran it right along where you start at to just outside of tuscawoola yard(the area where two tracks cross into one),and then I derail again pass some lumber company by a forest not too far down.I used a normal freeware SD40-2 and like 15 mixed freight cars to run a local.I even tried it with nothing but coal cars,and the same thing happens,usually shutting the game down.I talked to Plainsman,he said all my cars using that coupler code(I did another post to see if my cars were too weak that he answered),and he says he runs them all the time with that and there's no problems.I've ran all types of trains and well,I derail(and yes I've got the derail option turned off).so any help would be great.I guess I'd have to show you and others where I'm talking about in another area,and provide pictures,that would really help.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Turn on the Compass with 0 (Zero) and write down the co-ordinates of locations where you get derailments. Also make a note of the direction you are traveling in, the degrees of which being shown by the Compass.

                              O t t o
                              Web site: www.otto-wipfel.co.uk

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