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BLW/ZT Conn River Passenger Set - Progress Shots

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  • rfranzosa
    replied
    Nice!

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  • dcarleton
    replied
    There is a plan 4036A Pullman in preservation, Clover Glade:

    The "Clover Glade", a sleeper car, ran in Pullman service on the MKT line. In 2009, the car was on display at a railroad museum.


    Note that this was originally a Gothic Pullman from before WW1, as were Clover Trail and Clover Glen.

    Leave a comment:


  • rfranzosa
    replied
    Thanks, David!

    I went back to the photos I had used. The window arrangement on the right side of the car came from the Southern Railway version (Clover Pasture, Clover Way), which has an extra window near the vestibule, and the sections were shifted more toward the rear of the car. In other photos (Clover Meadow, Clover Trail and a generic Precision Scale model), the extra window is missing and the sections are closer to the vestibule. I will need to investigate further!

    Rick

    EDIT: Checking the Pullman Project spreadsheet, the two 8-5 sleepers assigned to the Montrealer/Washingtonian (Clover Trail & Clover Glen) are both plan 4036A, both owned by NYC (Michigan Central), with Clover Trail sold to Sonora Baja 7/30/67 and renamed "Escarcega" - as shown in your message above. Southern Railway's Clover Pasture and Clover Way are plan 4036E. Good catch!
    Last edited by rfranzosa; 08-14-2024, 12:10.

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  • dcarleton
    replied
    This is the car formerly known as Clover Trail in a storage line in Mexico:

    Note the window spacing, and that the sections are at the end of the car closest to the vsstibule, and that the blister covering the air-conditioning duct does not extend beyond the end of the sections. On this particular car. Not all Clover cars were of the same plan!

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  • rfranzosa
    replied
    Currently these are 1048x1048 ace. I need to investigate .DDS,


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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  • Unoriginal
    replied
    Was just curious, but are you guys using .DDS textures for this set? or still the old .ace textures?

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  • rfranzosa
    replied
    😊


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

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  • dcarleton
    replied
    Originally posted by rfranzosa View Post
    If you have contrary evidence, please let me know!
    Evidence is that in 1956 all of the NYC cars shown above were painted as you have them.

    Leave a comment:


  • bootednancy
    replied
    Thank you Rick
    I will be talking to you near year's end............perhaps the LI's P-72 would be the easiest first start to get the correct body shape. It was a diesel hauled coach (80 cars) and doesn't require electrical equipment or cab controllers..though that's simple too............all MU's (MP-54, MP-72c) except the double deckers and from the M-1 cars onwards used the standard "center off" Otis Elevator controller.

    It is good to see some decent heavyweight NYC-Pullman cars being done. The ones in the Library leave a lot to be desired from the "Generic Heavyweight" set with bad window and door placements (re: Santa Fe heavyweights, et al)

    Leave a comment:


  • mikebond
    replied
    Very nice!

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  • rfranzosa
    replied
    Originally posted by dcarleton View Post

    When the Pullman Company was broken up after the war, the cars were apportioned out to the railroads based on Pullman mileage operated by the railroads in prior years. The Central had been one of the three largest operators based on mileage and thus became one of the largest recipients of cars from the Pullman fleet. The deal was that the cars were conveyed to the railroads and the railroads leased the cars back to Pullman for operation, presumably on the owning railroad. But passenger business on the Central was crashing, so their cars which were LTP (leased to pool) could be assigned to whichever trains needed the space regardless of which railroad.

    Later on (1958?), the Central cancelled their operating contract with Pullman and took over operating their own sleeping cars directly.

    Something else to keep in mind while doing research – A comparatively small portion of the fleet was never conveyed to the railroads. New York Central style two-tone grey was often used by Pullman as a de-facto standard for Pullmans which were retained under Pullman Company ownership. Even the car names were done in the same font. So, when looking through consist lists recorded by railfans, or when looking through old photographs, remember that two-tone grey does not always mean New York Central. Official Pullman documentation will be most reliable.
    ​
    Very good question(s), David. I'm relying on the CVRHS articles on the Montrealer/Washingtonian from a few years back, the cars are listed as NYC, but the only photo in the article is an undated photo of one of the 'Dover' cars taken probably in Mott Haven. I've been going on the assumption that Thornton Waite and his collaborators are correct in the NYC ownership and that 1956 is far enough into the LTP era that the cars would be lettered NYC, with the small Pullman designation at the ends. If you have contrary evidence, please let me know!

    Thanks,

    Rick


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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  • dcarleton
    replied
    Originally posted by rfranzosa View Post
    I was surprised to see the NYC Pullmans represented, but they were only assigned from 1955-7.
    When the Pullman Company was broken up after the war, the cars were apportioned out to the railroads based on Pullman mileage operated by the railroads in prior years. The Central had been one of the three largest operators based on mileage and thus became one of the largest recipients of cars from the Pullman fleet. The deal was that the cars were conveyed to the railroads and the railroads leased the cars back to Pullman for operation, presumably on the owning railroad. But passenger business on the Central was crashing, so their cars which were LTP (leased to pool) could be assigned to whichever trains needed the space regardless of which railroad.

    Later on (1958?), the Central cancelled their operating contract with Pullman and took over operating their own sleeping cars directly.

    Something else to keep in mind while doing research – A comparatively small portion of the fleet was never conveyed to the railroads. New York Central style two-tone grey was often used by Pullman as a de-facto standard for Pullmans which were retained under Pullman Company ownership. Even the car names were done in the same font. So, when looking through consist lists recorded by railfans, or when looking through old photographs, remember that two-tone grey does not always mean New York Central. Official Pullman documentation will be most reliable.
    ​

    Leave a comment:


  • eric
    replied
    Glad to see Dover Strait in the grouping --- that's alive, restored and operable out at the IRM thanks to a guy by the name of Roger Kramer, who also bought the Iowa Pacific 515 (ex-CNW 515) as well as some other pieces, and led its restoration largely out of his own pocket.

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  • rfranzosa
    replied
    Thanks, Eric,

    This has been such an interesting project. The Montrealer/Washingtonian changed consists regularly year over year, with PRR, NH, B&M, CV, CN equipment. I was surprised to see the NYC Pullmans represented, but they were only assigned from 1955-7. I'm working from a detailed spreadsheet created by Dr Horvath. 1931-1966 with 57 different sleepers represented. It was just luck that I had a 1956 timetable to work from.

    Rick

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  • eric
    replied
    I agree. The quality and detail in Rick's IC heavyweight and lightweight cars from the IC pack from a couple years ago is a huge leap from some of the older options.

    Having stock for the NH and NYC is a great addition.

    Leave a comment:

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