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Thread: Metro North or LIRR M-1

  1. #21
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    Supposedly, that V is a mockup, which might explain some of the shoddiness. Unfortunately, all the self-touting articles written about the mockup do not discuss what isn't functional.

    Looks like it will be easy enough for the MSTS skinners - somebody did not have much imagination when they stuffed "SEPTA" on the sides.

    -Kurt

  2. #22
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    Default Silverliner V

    Yeah, it's a mockup for sure, it only had half the interior inside and a big cardboard cutout covering the unfinished side with a printed artists rendition of what the rest would look like. We also got to look in the cab, and all the controls were mockups too, just wood and cardboard. There's nothing wrong with that, it's a technique to see if everything you designed on paper/CAD really lays out the way you thought. We used to do it with satellites too.

    I agree that the paint scheme they chose is dumb looking. How about a nice, simple window band of blue & red. Or just leave them stainless and do a small logo and "SEPTA." Or better yet, paint them Tuscan and put "PENNSYLVANIA" in gold leaf on the letterboard...

    I think the structure WAS supposed to be representative of the production cars though, hence my comments on the weld. I DO hope they get better now that they've gotten to test build one.

    Talking to the SEPTA rep inside, he admitted that the Budd & St. Louis Silverliners will probably be around a while after the SLVs come online, probably at least 2010.

    Steve
    Last edited by mestevet; 10-12-2008 at 12:58 PM.

  3. #23
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    Default Back on the M-1

    By the way, the M-1 traction motors were GE 1255, according to the manual. Does that help any more with the TE curves?

    Steve

  4. #24
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    I read or was told in the 70s that the Patco cars were elecrically identical to the M1s, except the top was 75 MPH which was cut down to 60 for maintenance reasons.

  5. #25
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    bavli - I noticed the discussion about your trip and the "cruise control" in the overspeed thread. Another thing I was reading about in the M-1 cars was the Automatic Train Operation. The system they described was such that when engaged (a throttle position past P4) in ATC territory, that it would maintain allowable signal speed and reduce speed for a lesser aspect automatically (by a maximum service brake application) or accelerate at the maximum rate as required. Of course, all the signaling equipment and ATC has to be set up for it, but that's a fancier type of "cruise control" if you ask me.

    Do the newer EMUs (like the other Metro North or LIRR cars) have this feature? I'm not aware that the SEPTA equipment has it - I'll have to check the spec. on the SLVs. How about any of the NJT EMUs?

    Sounds like you had a nice trip bavli, good to have you back.

    Steve

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by mestevet View Post
    By the way, the M-1 traction motors were GE 1255, according to the manual. Does that help any more with the TE curves?
    It might help, at least with the P1 and P2 positions, if I could actually find the motor curves somewhere but so far no luck. In the positions with field shunting a lot depends upon the control system.

    BTW, I'm able to duplicate the braking performance in MSTS faithfully. I can even duplicate the feathering off of the brake right before stopping which I'm pretty sure all modern transit equipment does (I know the subway cousins of the M1, the R44 and R46, do this).

    bavli - I noticed the discussion about your trip and the "cruise control" in the overspeed thread. Another thing I was reading about in the M-1 cars was the Automatic Train Operation. The system they described was such that when engaged (a throttle position past P4) in ATC territory, that it would maintain allowable signal speed and reduce speed for a lesser aspect automatically (by a maximum service brake application) or accelerate at the maximum rate as required. Of course, all the signaling equipment and ATC has to be set up for it, but that's a fancier type of "cruise control" if you ask me.

    Do the newer EMUs (like the other Metro North or LIRR cars) have this feature? I'm not aware that the SEPTA equipment has it - I'll have to check the spec. on the SLVs. How about any of the NJT EMUs?
    The newer EMUs do have a feature where an overspeed condition automatically applies the brake until the speed falls under the speed limit. This is operational over most of the LIRR and Metro North. No idea if a second feature to maintain the speed limit is available. This would actually be fairly straightforward to implement on AC motor equipment. You just cap the inverter frequency at whatever speed equals the speed limit, and then let the train accelerate. I'd honestly be surprised is such a feature doesn't exist. It's a great thing to have in that it allows the driver's attention to focus more on what's in front of the train than on maintaining the limit. And it eliminates variability in speed along a stretch of track, hopefully allowing trains to be more closely spaced as well as reducing running time (i.e. most schedules don't require the driver sit right on the speed limit because doing so without automation is not something which all engineers could do consistently). As for having this feature in MSTS, forget it without rewriting the source code. But it can be crudely implemented in BVE, believe it or not.

  7. #27

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    -snip-
    Last edited by larsmars223; 10-26-2008 at 12:00 AM. Reason: Link to pirated files

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by larsmars223 View Post
    Well there is the ACR M1/M3, and I think that you can repaint it due to the ACR is no longer in operation


    -Lars
    BE CAREFUL, those models created a huge mess.

  9. #29
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    Yes, let's do avoid messes. Please keep in mind that I started this thread specifically mentioning that the interest was in legitimate, legal, original models of the M1.

    Along those lines, here's something I whipped up in about two hours this afternoon while the wife had the kids out:



    Clearly it's a very quick model and texture (you couldn't really even tell the shape without a texture, so I had to put something on there). The first photo I found online was a Metro North photo, so that's why I patterned it that way.

    Steve
    Last edited by mestevet; 10-12-2008 at 06:35 PM.

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by captain82 View Post
    BE CAREFUL, those models created a huge mess.
    A mess in what way?

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