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Thread: Coonskin - AI stuff

  1. #1
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    Default Coonskin - AI stuff

    Figured I should start another thread instead of tipping the TANE one off topic. You were asking about the AI, couple of videos;

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnpf9VgjG68

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBlsCMu7Kdo

    And cabviews;

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klSOHICkdYo

  2. #2
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    Here's another AI:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv3iEH0CPak

    The flexibility of AI (best watched full screen and in HD):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39iJz4AmlMU

    And a cab ride:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXuKxOYs14Q

    Phil

  3. #3
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    Thanks Jim, for starting a new thread. I see from your videos that the AI is quite capable in regards to keeping themselves moving in a logical manner. I also suspect that your involvement with Trainz predates TS2010, so your version is one previous? If so, that's encouraging that I can at least expect AI performance as good as you were getting.

    Phil:

    Your videos are taken in TS2012. I'll be starting with TS2010. I hope that similar logic will be possible within TS2010 as you illustrated.

    My biggest concern at this point is the use of signals. Are they required for the AI logic? Or, does the program read the paths and see what's available and routes the AI accordingly, signals or not?

    My concern about signals is that I am a fan of early eras and "dark" territory: No signals. Will the AI in TS2010 be able to proceed among player moves in a signal-less environ?

    I must say, though, that the examples you have shared via YouTube does make urban switching/operations look like fun in Trainz!

    Thanks to both of you for helping me understand what I'm downloading and (hoping) to get up and running.

  4. #4
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    All my videos are from TS2010, which was the first version of Trainz I figured out how to work the AI. No signals, dunno - never tried it. They will navigate from one waypoint to the next without signals, but preventing collisions? No idea. All else fails there are invisible signals you can use. As for TS2010 and TS12, there are a few differences but the AI is exactly the same. A route and session (session = activity) created in TS2010 runs in TS12 out of the box with no modification needed.

  5. #5
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    Andre --

    My biggest concern at this point is the use of signals. Are they required for the AI logic? Or, does the program read the paths and see what's available and routes the AI accordingly, signals or not?

    I agree with Jim's comments above. I've never actually tired to run a single track + crossing loops + AI in both directions without using signals. I suspect that it might work but one of us would have to try it to confirm that assertion.

    My concern about signals is that I am a fan of early eras and "dark" territory: No signals. Will the AI in TS2010 be able to proceed among player moves in a signal-less environ?

    I'm sure the answer to that is "no". One of the issues in the simulation is to avoid a Mexican Standoff, where a Player train proceeds along a single track section but can't take the free track at the next crossing loop because an AI train has taken control of the facing switch and set it to the wrong line.

    The best way to avoid this is to use "Signal Link", shown in this video. The Player train is the yellow locomotive.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdnoFpD5Fr8

    But, as Jim says, you can always use invisible signals.

    The other "cool" feature that I really enjoy are model railroadz. They can be quick to construct and fun to operate. Here:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBIDsemJNRw

    and here:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6CWWmgH--k

    Oh yes, and interactive industries and freight cars:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMlhkDnteOg

    and:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnCCLhuhh38

    Phil

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coonskin View Post
    ... My biggest concern at this point is the use of signals. Are they required for the AI logic? Or, does the program read the paths and see what's available and routes the AI accordingly, signals or not?

    My concern about signals is that I am a fan of early eras and "dark" territory: No signals. Will the AI in TS2010 be able to proceed among player moves in a signal-less environ? ...
    The video below is from Trainz 2012, but it should work in 2010 as well.

    There are no signals in use. Turnouts control train movements.

    Operating under AI control, Engineer's Adair's train has orders to navigate to "B Town" while engineer's Alan's train has orders to navigate to "A Town". There is a passing siding in between "A" and "B" on which track direction markers are used, to force each train to use the right-hand track.


  7. #7

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    There are "invisible" signals that only show up in the HUD:



    Harold

  8. #8
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    Thanks to all for your input to date.

    Time for an update:

    * I have been able to download all the data packs.

    * The Setup.exe ran flawlessly and TS2010 has been successfully installed on my machine.

    * I have opened the "Manual" and did a quick browsing of it: It appears that pdf is in good order.

    * I have been able to open a route. (It fell to Jim's PO&N for the honor of my first look inside TS2010! Congrats Jim!)

    Obviously, this is very different than MSTS. I didn't readily see a way to select a train and go for a spin. (Oh dread, I must RTFM!) However, unlike MSTS, apparently you can enter the route without being in a train! Weird. That I did, looking over some of the PO&N before exiting.

    While looking at the "Routes" menu, and reading the description of a highlighted route, I noticed that some of the routes included with the install had a note at the bottom of the description stating it needed "Such and such assets from this location". So, am I too assume I need to download more stuff in order to run those routes?

    Also, when I first started the program after its initial installation, a pop-up window appeared informing me that the program was "Updating the database". It took a LOONG time this to be accomplished. Will it do this each and every time I open the program? (In contrast, I am used to clicking one of my MSTS mini-installs and be looking at the opening menu screen within a few seconds.)

    Wow... apparently I have MUCH to learn before I can even hop in a train and go sight-seeing.

  9. #9
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    Yep, first thing you gotta learn is the PO&N in Trainz ain't mine, that was made by philskene which is probably why it's upside down.

    I made a beginners guide tutorial but I just looked at it and saw the pictures are gone, main reason I no longer use image shack or photo bucket.

    Essentially if you're not already attached to a loco, right click on the terrain to move the free camera around (takes a lot of getting used to the controls) then left click on the body of a loco. 1 takes you into the cab, right click and move the mouse or use arrow keys to pan the view around inside the cab. I use Raildriver for everything but IIRC the same left click and drag on the controls works. 2 key for exterior, 4 key to go back to free cam so you can walk around the yard clicking on switches to set the route. Or use the M key to bring up the ingame map, click on switches in the map. Other option click the driver face to expand the driver list, click on any driver to change to the loco that he's in. F5 hides all the menus, CTRL H toggles the arrows above the switches on and off. The turntables you have to hover the mouse over to bring up those arrows, then click on them to rotate the turntable. ] and [ change to head out or other cab view positions if the model has any.

  10. #10
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    Thanks Jim.

    Your little "quick help" post has got me in the sim and puttering about. (And helped me avoid the "RTFM" part of this for a bit longer!)

    This is VERY different. Gonna' take some getting used to. I do hope that the steam locomotives have a "head out" view, with panning ability, as in MSTS. I very much miss that feature. So far, I'm using the DCC mode to just explore around and learn to throw switches, operate turntables, and all that jazz.

    What I plan to do is get familiar with navigating within the sim, learning the new keyboard functions, and so forth. It will also be important to me to activate "In Cab" control and sample the physics. Once I'm comfortable with navigating about and operating within a route, I then hope to find "Rollins Pass", download some steam engines, and really get down to evaluating whether this sim is going to be able to take a long term place alongside MSTS/OR on my hard drive.

    Off to go take the granddaughter back to the daughter and eat supper with them. Oh yeah... and the son-in-law, too.

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