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Thread: Windows 10 Free Upgrade+MSTS/Open Rails

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeebb View Post
    * The applet downloads the upgrade when it is offered. You choose a time to install it. Note: the upgrade will uninstall any incompatible software that it finds during the installation process.
    GRRR! I really don't like that idea of having half of my computer's programs uninstalled. As long as you can re-install them fine.

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeebb View Post
    * Win8 and Win10 are designed to never be shut down: at most, they hibernate unless you find a way to trigger a complete shutdown (it's possible, but you have to do a little digging unless you have one of those start-menu-replacement apps in Win8). So in ordinary use they appear to start up very quickly.
    What are these guys smoking? I never leave my equipment on 24/7! I shut them down (Turn Off The Power With A Power Strip) when I am not using them. Especially when Electrical storms are in the area... (With really bad storms I may even unplug the cords from the power strip...) And they always get powered down when I go to sleep!

    I am sure many consumers do the same. Why make it hard to do so? I hope there is a way to create some kind of shortcut on the desktop to make this happen. (I had such a thing for WIN XP, even though I really did not need it.)

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeebb View Post
    * When you set up Win8 or 10 it is very difficult to do limited user accounts. Again, not impossible, but at least the Home versions hide well the ability to set up local admin and limited accounts. They apparently want you to run as admin with a permanent connection to the MS Store. This is good for security how??????
    Permanent Internet Connection? NO! I still use DialUp, and while it is unlimited use, apparently the software still offers by the minute. Think about the bills coming in the mail for the Constant Electricity use and Constant Minutes that are being charged for using Windows 10. TOO EXPENSIVE to operate in my opinion. It's bad enough having to pay a fortune for the operating system, and new hardware to support it. Not everyone can afford all this other stuff.

    And Children & Teens having Administrator Privileges on their parents computers? Well, how many parents are going to constantly have their computer setups damaged from kids doing stupid things, and an installing viruses from every place out there. DUMB!!!

    And who decided to make "MS Store" the center of the universe? If I have to make a permanent connect with something, it would not be that place!

    And yes, constant internet connections to any place, does not provide good security.

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeebb View Post
    * Windows updates cannot be refused or rescheduled in Win10 Home - you must take them when they are pushed or else your Windows will be deactivated. And they can (will) be pushed "when ready" not waiting on Patch Tuesday. Win10 Pro copies will be able to delay but not refuse updates - supposedly by up to several months. The only Win10 with update capabilities similar to earlier Windows versions (where you have complete control over when/if) will be Enterprise, which is not part of the "free" upgrade program in Win 7/8 versions.
    Well, so much for my upgrading or buying Windows 10 anytime soon. As I noted above, I am still forced to use DialUp. Until I can get off that and get faster speeds, there is no way I can let updates get installed the instant it comes out. I have to pick and choose which updates to download them, and set a time to do so, which may be a while. (Especially since I turn off my internet, and shut down my equipment when I am not using them...)

    Forcing a Deactivation of Windows for not installing updates? NO! That's gone to far. If I don't want to install updates for whatever reason, that should be my choice. Especially since I have heard that some updates have been known to cause issues with software. The last thing I want is to have half of my programs to stop working from some faulty update.



    Shame to hear about these new Windows features. I was actually looking forward to getting Windows 10.

    Thanks MS, but No Thanks... I'll just stick with using Windows 7 until I die. It does everything I need it to do, and does it on my terms.
    Yardmaster of the Great American Moose Paint Shops.
    a Moose Interchange Rail Company division.
    http://mjrmstsrepaints.proboards.com
    TTFN!

  2. #22

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    I run a desktop pc with Windows 8.1 and shut down every night using the standard Settings / power / shutdown to do so. No issues there. Runs MSTS and OR very well. I prefer to run OR and rarely run MSTS.

    I do not care for the Windows 8.1 app icons/Start pages and use the standard desktop that 8.1 provides. Again, no issues there. Just takes a little getting used to, at first.

  3. #23

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    Last edited by smiljacc18; 07-27-2015 at 04:13 PM.

  4. #24

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    Yet another idea that Mr. Billy thought was "good" for us - NOT!!

    His ultimate goal is to control every Windows PC! Don't fall into that trap!

  5. #25
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    When I bought the monitor for my pc, it came with a CD that had the drivers on it. I loaded them. I have not had one issue with my monitor and graphics... I have never had any reason to go and Update Them. Why should I? You know the old saying, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Now Microsoft is going to be forcing users to update graphic drivers when a new version comes out?

    Just like the article says, many users should now expect to have problems.

    Nothing like buying a new PC at the store you bring it home, it works for a few days, your computer forces you to install a new driver, and wham, broken PC. Not even a month old. I can see a few lawsuits being aim at Microsoft after that.

    I can recall many members here talking about having graphic driver issues running their train sims, and trying to undo the update, or finding that specific version to get everything working again. And this was before Win 10, when everything was optional. I can see it now...the numerous posts upon posts soon to be in the Win 10 section noting "I can't get this sim to work, please help." And what happens if you are able to install an older driver to get everything working again. Does WIN 10 then force you to install the new one...again. VICIOUS LOOP! (I think the article mentions this.)

    And we already know, that MSTS has been having limited use in Windows 8.0/8.1 due to driver issues and certain graphics cards. I seem to recall that, for the most part, it would only run on NVIDIA Cards... And now it seems that MSTS, won't be running at ALL on Win 10, because of NVIDIA being a problem now too...

    And what about ORTS? Will that be usable now in Win 10 with the constant changing of graphics drivers throughout the industry? Unfortunately, I can see the ORTS TEAM constantly having to devote all their time to create a new update every day to compensate for new game drivers. That won't last long. As for the rest of the Sims out there, I can see the same thing happening there too.

    What A Mess!
    Yardmaster of the Great American Moose Paint Shops.
    a Moose Interchange Rail Company division.
    http://mjrmstsrepaints.proboards.com
    TTFN!

  6. #26
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    Typical MS arrogance, if you ask me - the days when they were at least a little bit approachable as in the run up to MSTS seem to have long gone.

    If Windows 10 doesn't even allow you to power off your PC then IMHO it's malware, pure and simple. It will not get a look in on any of my hardware until it either breaks and I'm forced to buy new, or they pull the plug on W7.

    BTW does anyone know how to get rid of the annoying Win 10 upgrade button which nests itself in the Taskbar?
    Vern.

  7. #27
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    His ultimate goal is to control every Windows PC!
    So how is that anything new? You do not own any software that you didn't actually write yourself. That includes Windows and MSTS. Read the license. MS has the right - and the duty! - to update things as needed. When they don't want to support you any more, they don't have to unless you have a paid contract for them to do it (see: XP). There's an implied contract for certain types of "free" support for a length of time defined by the MS support and end-of-life policies. Where it gets a little squirrelly is when the update is a hardware driver - those should be gotten from the hardware maker, not Microsoft, to be sure you have the right one. And yes, there have been a few (surprisingly few) actual bad updates, including some where if you were unlucky and the retraction/redo update didn't work Windows had to be reinstalled (backups!!!).

    Windows (and other software) updates are needed for security, in most cases, and occasionally to fix or upgrade something else. Security updates are usually "critical" or "important" - the other stuff may simply be "recommended." There are some discussions of the W10 update issue that suggest the must-accept ones are the "critical" security updates and you may have some control over the others - can't tell yet until the system actually starts appearing, in RTM form, in the wild.

    There is no such thing as software without bugs. At least MS so far is still trying to keep up with the attacks on the versions of Windows it's willing to support; some other software makers are not as aggressive about patching things. And for free/open source stuff you're at the mercy of somebody donating their time - most FOSS people attend to business, but some don't. Of course, if you have the source code and the development tools, you can take care of it yourself ... right! Or, with some packages, you can pay a consultant to provide support for you.

    MSTS has been having limited use in Windows 8.0/8.1 due to driver issues and certain graphics cards
    That's true. The other thread on the subject ( https://www.trainsim.com/vbts/showth...c-card-in-MSTS ) recently provided a way to fix that. It takes advantage of a Windows standard that is often missed: when searching for a support file, Windows looks first in a program's startup directory, then in the Windows directories, then in the specified paths (an environment variable). So in theory you can have a .dll with the same name in any of those locations, and the first one found is what's used. That doesn't always work - you usually can't replace a Windows system file by having a copy in your program directory. But sometimes it works, and apparently that's what was done to fix the ATI issue. That approach should still work in Win10. Of course, to do tweaks like that you have to be fairly familiar with Windows internals, which many people are not, but if it works reliably then somebody can publish a script or a small application to do the job.

    If Windows 10 doesn't even allow you to power off your PC
    I didn't say that. But with Win8 and later the ability to fully shut down is somewhat hidden. Their product designers felt, apparently, that people would like it to start up very quickly, and the easiest way to do that is to avoid cold boots - if, at most, it hibernates (saves state to disk, then shuts off, restoring the state next time power is applied) then the startup time is minimized. At least it isn't like some office systems yet, where the computer starts up on its own in the middle of the night to do updates (usually from the corporate server) whether you shut it down or not. And yes, I do completely shut my computer down when I will be away for a while - saves power and heat, and reduces the hacker attack surface.

    ORTS TEAM constantly having to devote all their time to create a new update every day to compensate for new game drivers
    Yes, that could be a problem. But it's unlikely to happen. Drivers don't come out THAT often. And ORTS could (probably already has) sign up with developer programs at the video card makers that give them advance notice of changes and allow the card makers to do driver tweaks to make the game run better. A bigger issue with ORTS is its dependence on the XNA abandonware - MS no longer supports it, and ORTS uses an older version than the final one anyway. Moving to a different game engine will eventually be necessary, but constant revisions to keep up with game engine changes (not just Windows itself) will be a bigger hassle than the occasional driver tweak. Anyway, if you could use ORTS and MSTS in Windows 8, you should be able use them in 10 as well - the differences aren't really all that big.

  8. #28
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    BTW does anyone know how to get rid of the annoying Win 10 upgrade button which nests itself in the Taskbar?
    Click on the little up-arrow in the Taskbar (opens the area where things are that you don't have to see all the time) and click on the "Customize" link. In the list shown after that, set the "GWX" application to "Hide icon and notifications".

    If you want to bail on the upgrade entirely, there's information at MS and several Windows hacker sites on how to back out the update that brought in that applet. Google is your friend for that.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeebb View Post
    Click on the little up-arrow in the Taskbar (opens the area where things are that you don't have to see all the time) and click on the "Customize" link. In the list shown after that, set the "GWX" application to "Hide icon and notifications".

    If you want to bail on the upgrade entirely, there's information at MS and several Windows hacker sites on how to back out the update that brought in that applet. Google is your friend for that.
    Thanks Mike. Hiding the notification will do for now.
    Vern.

  10. #30
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    The original Windows 8 was just too naked of an attempt to tabletize the PC operating system. Windows 8.1 brought back some of the PC features, and when 8.1 is combined with a third party shell application (I use Classic Shell), it works and looks just like an XP/Vista/7 PC does. I routinely power down my 8.1 every night, and I do admit that I have gotten used to the Fast Boot feature when starting from cold. It goes cold to hot in less time it takes me to enter my password.

    Win 10 rigid update is just more tabletizing of the PC OS

    Tablets owners generally do not power their devices off everyday, they simply auto-hibernate.

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