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Thread: Don Karch's multiple Railroad route - Colorado

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
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    Jacksonville,, FL, USA.
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    Cool Don Karch's multiple Railroad route - Colorado

    Colleagues,

    When Don Karch took his last call late last year, we lost one of our most
    prolific route creators, especially of narrow gauge & standard gauge of
    roads in Colorado. My favorite is his Rollins Pass line.

    Don sent his unfinished routes to Andre Ming, and Andre passed the one
    route that comprises the South Park, D&RGW, and CM on to me and as I
    am winding down the MCOA2, just tweaking things my checkers find,
    I have started on what I will refer to as the "Karch" route for simplicity.
    Don had done the D&RGW from Gunnison east to Parlin, which is also
    on the South Park line. This left a gap of 70 miles or so, over Marshall
    Pass to Poncha Jct. I am doing that portion, trying hard to use the
    same techniques, foliage, structures, etc. that Don used. I have also
    added the "Valley" line for about 10 miles over Poncha Pass and a short
    branch from Shirley to originally a mine, and later a ore processor.
    Don or Andre had added the Monarch branch and the Calumet Branch.
    The latter is rather obscure but I have found a little bit about it, and it
    basically served mine. I have most of the new track & roads done and
    only lack the short branch from Shirley (east foot of Marshall Pass)
    and a few roads. The image with several structures and a roundhouse
    is Sargents, CO and the other, on a tight horseshoe curve with the start
    of some snow sheds is Marshall Pass

    J. H. Sullivan
    (landnrailroader)
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  2. #2
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    Aug 2002
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    Poteau, OK, USA.
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    Looking good, Jerry!

    I'm sure there are many of us waiting patiently in the wings for this, the final, version of Don's Colorado Mega Route.
    Andre Ming
    V Scale Creations.com R.I.P

  3. #3
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    May 2010
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    Halfway between Portland and Seattle in the Shifting Sands
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    15

    Default

    Was he working on the Denver Belt as well?

  4. #4
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    Nov 1999
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    Default

    As far as I know, he wasn't. Don focused most of his attention on the 1920 or so era, although
    his Joint Line and the Moffat portion of Rolllins Pass, i.e. the line through Moffat Tunnel could be
    any era.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
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    Jacksonville,, FL, USA.
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    Wink Further work at Marshall Pass

    Colleagues,

    It would have been nice to use the snow sheds from Lizard Head Pass on the OR (or RGS)
    route but these would not fit the situation, so I am creating a few custom pieces. I
    have single & double track sheds done, in 20, 40, & 60 ft. lengths. And I have done the
    turntable. I need to do a left-hand turnout off double track, and left & right turnouts
    off single track. So here is another image, showing more of the main 2-track shed which
    actually sits in a deep cut. D&RG sheds were solid, and would have felt like a tunnel. I
    will do them this way, but if a future simmer of the route wishes, they can delete a
    section of shed if they wish as they will not be a solid unit, just the lengths mentioned.

    The station is at the lower left of the image, and the water tank was located out of the
    picture at the upper right. To the upper right is toward Salida, and to the left is
    Sargents and on to Gunnison.

    Jerry Sullivan
    (landnrailroader)
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  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
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    Jacksonville,, FL, USA.
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    Andre,

    It is going nicely. When I finish it, and before I release it, I will want to send you a copy for
    "nit picking" in addition to my 3 nit pickers anonymous - well not really. Those are Moe
    Smith, Simon Van de Laak, and Lukas Lussar. The worst part of the route is that
    Don put a lot of sagebrush in the valley east of Gunnison, which is probably correct for
    the period of the sim. Now that is a pretty nice agricultural area. I'm making the
    transition from arid valley to greener foothills at about the location of Elko, a siding and
    probably small station. In the days of this operation, just about every siding had some
    kind of station structure for a telegrapher to survive in. If you have an opportunity to
    pick up a John Norwood book on the D&RGW do so. I have bought 3 at reasonable
    prices from Amazon. John started as a telegrapher in 1935, retired as a high level
    officer in 1975, and is now deceased but he literally tells it like it is. I use his books
    and another that I have on the history of Marshall Pass as reference. In doing the
    terrain, Don did a great job blending colors etc., but they give my vision a fit----.

    Jerry

    Jerry

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
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    Jacksonville,, FL, USA.
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    Cool Snow Shed progress

    Colleagues,

    Books I have indicate there were 2 snow sheds on the Shavano Loop, actually
    a series of in/out "S" curves. There may have been more, but that is all I
    have found. The summit of the pass had a long shed along the horse shoe
    curve through a deep cut through the saddle that forms the pass. Most of
    this shed was double track, with a offset for the station, a turntable, and
    other stuff. On the west end, there was a stub siding in a shed that was
    more or less level, while another shed extended along the main line down the
    west slope for several hundred yards.

    I've had to make my own sheds for all this, but I am using the good texture
    from the RGS route, used on the Lizard Head sheds.

    So imagine you are a buzzard looking more or less east, over the first
    shed of the Shavano Loop. The thick line & blue specks at the to of the
    image is the sheds & tracks at the top of the pass. From the Shavano tank
    to the top of the pass was about 700 yards to walk, and 4 miles by the
    railroad, so it was not unusual for train crew to hop off at the tank and
    walk to the top and catch up on their train - easy, since it would stop at
    the top to turn up retainers.

    Jerry Sullivan
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  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
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    Jacksonville,, FL, USA.
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    Cool Karch's route, further progress

    Colleagues,

    I have detailed the line from Parlin east about 25 miles to Sargents and the
    community of Sargents is complete - though I may add some things here
    and there, and I do need to add some flat people.

    Until 1941, there was a through passenger train between Salida and
    Gunnison called the Shavano, so we will imagine ourselves back to some
    point prior to 1941. The Shavano approaches Sargents, CO eastbound
    and makes its relatively brief stop. Going east from here, the grade is
    rather light for about 5 miles, but then comes some 15 miles of 4%.
    Karch evidently liked player pianos and at each town, there is, of course,
    a saloon, with the piano twanging away. The original name of the town
    was Sargent, but the "S" on the end is seen on almost every reference,
    so we call it Sargents.

    Sargents had a dispatcher office with responsibility for Gunnison to
    Poncha Jct., turntable with one shed, wye, raised coaling trestle,
    and of course, cattle pens. In the high view, the cattle pen is seen in
    the far distance to the right.

    Jerry Sullivan
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  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
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    Cool More Progress, Buxton & Tank 7

    Colleagues,

    Detailing of the west slope has continued and now Buxton is complete as
    is Tank 7. Tank 7 was so named because it was 7 miles east of Sargents
    and it was also where the steepest part of the eastbound grade began,
    which then continued some 9 miles to the top of Marshall Pass. Tank 7
    was not a station, but the reference book I have shows 2 small structures
    that might have been tool houses, or track car sheds.

    Note that I have seemingly used Shavano & Shawano interchangeably.
    I have seen it spelled both ways, but the reference book I am using,
    besides the name of a peak near Marshall Pass, spells it Shawano, so
    I will use that spelling.

    The only problem I have encountered involves what to do with the
    telegraph lines when coming to a snowshed. It seems to me that the
    lines would have been carried through the shed in some fashion using
    insulators near the ceiling, so in those areas, I am simply deleting the
    poles. Don did not include snow sheds on any other part of the route
    as found so far, so these are my own, but I believe there were sheds
    in the area of Alpine Tunnel.

    Don did a great job of handling Alpine tunnel, which is on his previous
    version of the route, so all interested folks, should have it. It was not
    used very long, and it is to this day considered haunted because of an
    incident in which the engine crew were suffocated by fumes, and the
    locals claim that on certain nights near the tunnel, Dad Martinez can
    still be seen with his gloved hands on the throttle & airbrake.

    J. H. Sullivan
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  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    Carolina's
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    Default

    Due to constraints in MSTS Jerry it might be better to fudge the numbers and have the telegraph poles slightly closer to the track so they are not hanging off the cliff side. The same issue on the Mcoa2 is present in the screenshots above. The real world numbers from distance of track are not always obtainable due to MSTS course terrain management. A good bit of the real world has to be fudged in MSTS. The result is either the poles are closer to track than they would be in the real world or they end up hanging off the embankment causing them to appear to be floating in mid air which is just plain weird.

    I already managed to loose the data you sent me on pole distances but find they are unusable on mountainous routes because the issue I noted above.

    As for running the wires through the snow shed, As far as I am aware D&RGW practice would have been similar to the SP over Donner Pass in that wires were routed around the snow sheds on poles. I've a video of winter on Donner and the poles can be a good distance from track in snow shed areas.

    Robert

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