Results 1 to 6 of 6

Thread: Steep track gradient---

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
    Location
    Jacksonville,, FL, USA.
    Posts
    3,625

    Arrow Steep track gradient---

    Colleagues,

    In MSRE the maximum gradient is about 5%, i.e. MSRE value 3.00. Is it possible to lay
    grades steeper than that in TSRE, and if so, can the route continue to be edited in
    MSRE as long as the track pieces involved are not selected.

    I ask this question because in finishing Don Karch's mega Colorado route, someone
    had asked him to include the Calumet branch. The branch was about 7 miles long
    at it's longest, and this included stretches of mostly 6% grades with some 7%. If
    the route is laid entirely with MSRE, the upper end of the branch, beyond about
    mile 5.5 will be increasingly deeper under ground.

    And if one of the experienced TSRE users happens to volunteer, I can send the route
    via "WeTransfer" to that person in order to have the last 3 miles of this branch
    completed.

    I am experimenting on a scratch route but so far, I cannot get the track database
    lines to appear after deselecting all, and making some adjustment to a piece.


    I am using version V0.6956.

    J. H. Sullivan

  2. #2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by landnrailroader View Post
    Colleagues,

    In MSRE the maximum gradient is about 5%, i.e. MSRE value 3.00. Is it possible to lay
    grades steeper than that in TSRE, and if so, can the route continue to be edited in
    MSRE as long as the track pieces involved are not selected.

    ......................................snip........ .............................................
    I ask this question because in finishing Don Karch's mega Colorado route, someone
    had asked him to include the Calumet branch. The branch was about 7 miles long
    at it's longest, and this included stretches of mostly 6% grades with some 7%. If
    the route is laid entirely with MSRE, the upper end of the branch, beyond about
    mile 5.5 will be increasingly deeper under ground.
    And if one of the experienced TSRE users happens to volunteer, I can send the route
    via "WeTransfer" to that person in order to have the last 3 miles of this branch
    completed.I am experimenting on a scratch route but so far, I cannot get the track database
    lines to appear after deselecting all, and making some adjustment to a piece.
    I am using version V0.6956.J. H. Sullivan
    Hi Jerry,

    Yes, it certainly is!

    You can set any gradient by: 90 deg anyone?
    1. Select a track section, Press Z to remove the track section from the TDB. After the yellow lines gone you are free to move the track section. NEVER move a track section that has yellow lines displayed over it!

    2. After TDB lines are gone, select the track section again. At the left side of the screen note near the bottom of the
    Before setting gradients or moving any track you need to make sure there are no TDB yellow lines for the piece being moved!!!

    Safety Sermon On:
    VERY important! I always do my track editing with the manual TDB add method.
    MUCH less chance you will de-select a track section adding in into then TDB and forgetting in the heat of the moment to remove the yellow line first.
    It's much safer fiddling with track/roads and keeping control of the TDB in your control rather that the auto-add. . . . Preserving the integrity of the TDB is my method.
    You can't screw up a track if YOU control when it gets added into the TDB.
    Okay, end of safety sermon ... Here's a pic of the Left side-of-screen Object Panel. Lot's of really good stuff here!
    Heaven knows I had a long drawn out battle at ET with Goku to include all methods of measuring grades on railroads anywhere.

    TrackProperties.jpg

    On the Left panel, The Object Panel near bottom is The Elevation: section
    You can select any of the four gradient measurements here you want.

    With a 3% (percent) gradient, a selected track will display and can be changed in any of the following lines:
    Per Mille 30.00
    Per Cent 3.00
    Step 1 in 1.71836m
    Angle 1.733


    You can type into any of these fields any gradient you want.
    If you are using Percent or Permille or Angle, be sure to type in at least a 2 place decimal figure, ie 3.00 or 30.00 in these fields.
    I have not used the Step 1 in 'X'm field but I'd suggest using a two place decimal here also.

    The 3.00 will revert to a display of 3 if you re-select the track section for a "just to make sure check" of the gradient. No need to re-type or anything else unles you are changing the grade.
    Changing grade on already installed track? I'd suggest before changing the gradient it's less confusing if you re-snap the track setting it to zero grade and then apply the grade you want.
    Reason is sometimes the tracks rotation point is reversed, just like happens in the MSRE. Start at a zero reset position and you won't get in trouble.
    Of course the No Interactives rule applies. No interactives on the track vector you are adjusting.

    A Track Vector is = All track between 2 JnNodes, 2 EndNodes or a JnNode and a EndNode.

    If you get into a pickle, back off and reset the track you want to set the gradient and re-snap it to the track with the existing TDB yellow line.

    Track won't snap to another track section unless the snapped-to track is in the TDB.

    In the TSRE editor, track is NOT considered "track" until it's in the TDB with it's accompanying Yellow lines.

    Setting gradient is TSRE is, once you get used to it, MUCH easier and more accurate than MSTS every was.TrackProperties.jpg
    Please note the Step line at the bottom of Properties. This is a real joy to use. It is the amount a track section will move using the NumPad keys;
    Rotate L/R, the 4-6 keys, Up/Down, the 3-9 keys. The default setting of this field is 25.
    Setting this Step to a smaller number brings smaller and smaller rotation or move steps.
    Not sure but setting it to 1. 0 or smaller gives you a 1 millimeter rotation movement steps!
    This gives a SUPER FINE adjustment, fine enough for the most critical track installer.
    OttO (rip) would have loved this as I'm sure you know his views on track placement.

    If you want to I'll explain the Buttons on this panel. Please do not indiscriminately push buttons unless you 'know' what they do!

    The buttons are:
    Very Handy!
    Very Powerful!
    Very Dangerous!

    Got Rogue Blue Poles or Rogue TDB Items? This is the place you can fix things like that. Got all the broken PRR tdb item fixed. Took two years of 'counseling' Goku as to what a route builder needs and he came through with flying colors. That's why I sent him $50 bucks. His editor is seriously worth twice that any day!

    Best Regards,
    Last edited by Vince; 01-02-2019 at 10:11 PM.
    ............Vince ..............
    ...... Author NECv4 .......
    .... LIRR BUILD PHOTOS ....
    .............LIRR VIDEO.............
    ...... Eschew Obsfucation ......

    On the The Statue of Liberty in New York Harbor there is a Tablet. On it is written:
    "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
    the wretched refuse of your teeming shore, send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me,
    I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Poland
    Posts
    530

    Default

    You can easily use both TSRE and MSRE.
    Only thing you have to remember is not to remove huge amounts of tracks using TSRE, because it may cause MSRE to crash during track database save.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 1999
    Location
    Jacksonville,, FL, USA.
    Posts
    3,625

    Default

    I backed the route up to a DVD before doing anything, and since then I have tried 3 times to make the adjustment, each time
    fouling up someway, and restoring, so I decided to take the alternate approach. Around 1915, there was a flood that wiped out
    the branch beyond about mile 4.5. After that, some iron ore was taken out a location called "Turret" and loaded out around mile
    4. Turret is on the other side of a ridge, so I assume that, in those days, they used ox teams to move wagons of ore to the rail
    head. Don Karch had laid track as far as mile 4, and stopped, but by more careful gradient work, I have visible track as far as
    almost mile 5. So, track will end at mile 5.0, a loadout will go in about about mile 4. I put the full markers in a separate marker
    file so if someone is brave enough to try to lay the rest of the route, they can try and I will put an explanation in a documentation
    folder.

    J. H. Sullivan

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Just south of NYC
    Posts
    1,474

    Default

    You can do this. I learned because I needed as escape track with a 12% gradient. Without TSRE it would have been virtually impossible. Below is an example of using TSRE to lay that grade.
    BondTrack.jpg
    Chris
    "True rail fans have two favorite railroads. The B&O and one other."

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by longiron View Post
    You can do this. I learned because I needed as escape track with a 12% gradient. Without TSRE it would have been virtually impossible. Below is an example of using TSRE to lay that grade.
    BondTrack.jpg
    In the old days we used Michael Vones Object Rotator Spreadsheet & manual world file editing

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •