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Thread: Some help would be great

  1. #1
    Join Date
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    Default Some help would be great

    About 6 weeks ago my OR installation which had been working well suddenly began to crash on startup on any and all routes. I posted the logfile to the OR bug reporter but have gotten nothing so far. Very frustrating. If someone more computer fluent could give me a hint here it would be appreciated. Im using a Dell laptop with Windows 10.

    OpenRailsLog.txt

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Default

    David,

    Here's what I would do.
    I would download the latest Open Rails and do a fresh install. I would suggest the MonoGame version so you can experiment with ReShade, it's a game changer (pun intended).
    Put it in a different folder some where not in the program files or program files (86) folders..
    I use T:/Trains and D:msts and a couple others but you get the idea.
    If you have any shortcuts you'll have to change them.
    If this "install" works you can just delete the other one.

    Randy

  3. #3
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    Default

    agreed Windows now hates train sim being in the main folder files now so defently keep it seperate. Also you might want to make sure you have the most up todate stable version of OR. Sadly I ran into this issue earlier in the year when I mixed the New TS routes with the old one and it somehow screwed up my game a clean install fixed all and so did sperating the OR routes from MSTS.

  4. #4
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    Okay. I have a strong suspicion my problem with OR started at some point following a Windows 10 "update". I went from running perfectly to nada in one operating session. I did a reinstall but put it back in the old location in the Programs folder. The old definition of insanity comes to mind,,, Im going to put your suggestion to work and see where it goes. Im not familiar with the Monogame version or ReShade but I think I can figure it out. I will give you an update on how this goes in the event someone else having the same issue reads this. Thank you both for the help.

  5. #5
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    Default

    Just so I understand your suggestion is to create a separate drive partition for OR and MSTS etc?

  6. #6
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    Default

    I'm going to jump in here with suggestions and background.

    First, the need for a separate directory structure for Microsoft Train Simulator (MSTS) dates back to at least Window Vista, when Microsoft started to tighten its protection of files in \Program Files (including \Program Files (x86) for 32-bit software in 64-bit Windows). MSTS was and is not happy with that, and MS has listed it as incompatible and unsupported since at least Windows 7 if not Vista. The way around that has been well documented here and elsewhere (search for how to install MSTS in Vista).

    Open Rails (OR) *does* work in Program Files (x86) - it's a 32-bit program - if installed using the installer for the stable version. Your routes, trains, and other content must be outside of Program Files, however, to retain access to them for updates and additions. And if you want to use the weekly or unstable releases, it doesn't work; the updater usually fails among other things. So it's best to install OR, like MSTS, in its own directory structure outside of Program Files.

    MSTS and any content you plan to use with it must be at a directory level close to the root (e.g. C:\) of the disk. MSTS has an undocumented limit on the number of characters in the path name that it accepts for itself and anything it needs to open; I don't know the exact number, but it seems to be somewhere around 128 characters - OK for Program Files (as it expected in Windows 98), but may not be enough to put it in a Users directory. So follow the Steam4Me directions to install it near the root level of the disk.

    It is sometimes necessary to reformat the C: drive if Windows requires a fresh install. A fresh install is needed, for me, more often with Windows 10 than with older Windows versions. So although there usually isn't a problem with the Steam4Me method, and your MSTS installation under a directory like C:\trainsims\msts or c:\1msts is safe from any Windows update that doesn't format the disk, it's even safer to avoid that possibility.

    The ideal method is to set up a separate partition or use a separate physical disk for MSTS, Open Rails, and all of your related content. That also makes backups easier (just image that disk). First, install MSTS from the CDs or other media you have available, choosing the separate partition or disk and a suitable folder name (like 1msts) rather than the default. When you install the MS updates, it is also necessary to manually enter the name of the disk and folder you used (they don't pick that up from the registry), and older routes and other things may also need manual intervention (most things with actual installers will probably pick up the different install location from the registry, though). As a "data disk", the separate location is also easier to deal with in terms of regularizing Read-Only status of files and folders (turn it off), Ownership (should be you, not "System" or the Administrator), and Permissions (should be Full Control for you, or "Authenticated Users") - these are all Windows issues, and need to be checked once you're finished installing stuff because some older route installers, especially, set the ownership of files to System or Administrator which can get annoying.

    Once you're finished installing MSTS and any freeware routes that are designed to work with it (some may install in "mini-routes" if they are very large or complicated), install any payware routes that you have - again, especially with older ones, check to be sure the correct disk and folder structure is picked up by the installer, and manually adjust if needed.

    Finally, install Open Rails, again to a folder in the (train) sims partition or disk. When you first run Open Rails, it opens to its options tab where you can point it at the locations of your routes and other content; it will sometimes pick up the MSTS install location automatically.

    Side note: many old games respond to similar treatment. I've found, for instance, that the various *Tycoon games and Links 2003 (a golf game) work best if outside of Program Files. So I have an "oldegames" directory at the C:\ level (should be on a separate disk, perhaps the same one as MSTS and Open Rails if there's room) for them. I also placed Windows 3.1 (for Train Dispatcher 2) and the DOS Railroad Tycoon game folders in that location, and built config files for DOSBox to work with them there.

    That's the background for the instructions and suggestions in the prior comments. Everybody seems to have a minor tweak on the idea, often using different folder names, but in Vista and later (including Windows 10) the basic idea of installing at the disk root (of C: or some other disk) rather than in Program Files is universal.
    Last edited by mikeebb; 10-14-2019 at 01:51 AM.

  7. #7
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    Default

    Again, Thank you. I needed for someone to literally draw me a picture to get this done. I'll push ahead.

  8. #8
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    Well I moved the relevant files [OR, MSTS etc] out of C root and replaced them with fresh installs in newly created hard drive partitions. No Joy. Same log message referenced above popped up at statup and OR App crashed.

  9. #9
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    If you think the problem happened after a win 10 update, then look at some of the prerequisites possibly getting hosed. Things like XNA (if you are not monongame yet) or the .net framework 4.7 might need a reinstall, or the open rails app itself.

    Perhaps the update also made a blanket change in permissions for whatever temporary scratch space open rails uses

    Also, it does you good to occasionally clean out everything that accumulates in the c:\users\{username}\Appdata\Roaming\OpenRails subdirectory and the Loadcache subdirectory too. Its good can clean everything out of there periodically

  10. #10
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    Since this happened with an update take a look at your video drivers. Hit the windows key and start typing "device".
    You want device manager.
    Check the date of the drivers on the display adapter. Try rolling them back if you can. Then test.
    Gotta start somewhere.

    Randy

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