Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 22

Thread: Slack and yank?

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    139

    Default

    thanks for this information Scottb613 and Baldwin sorry to ask for clarification but what though does this mean in simpler terms:

    "the controlling friction limiting the length of a train should be the friction between 5 MPH and 10 MPH - not the startup... In ORTS it is definitely the startup..."

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    New York, USA.
    Posts
    1,965

    Default

    Hi...

    The bottom line is - the startup friction of a train should be irrelevant - as you are starting the train a single car at a time - it's the friction when traveling at a slow speed with the full weight of the train behind you that should stop you if you've exceeded the capacity of the locomotive... In ORTS - if you can start a train you can pull a train - given a constant grade without introducing of new variables...

    Whether right or wrong - these are the conclusions I've drawn from this series articles and my own testing of ORTS...

    Freight Train Resistance and Tonnage Ratings
    Part 1)
    https://archive.org/details/railwaym.../n100/mode/2up

    Part 2)
    https://archive.org/details/railwaym...e/146/mode/2up

    Part 3)
    https://archive.org/details/railwaym...e/204/mode/2up

    Your mileage may vary...

    Regards,
    Scott

  3. #13
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Pacific Time
    Posts
    915

    Default

    In very early betas of ORTS (before 1.0), slack was explicitly modeled, and was reported in the F5 HUD. That vanished at 1.0 and later. Not sure if it was modeled correctly, but you could see it in the HUD being pulled out on starting (by car or groups of cars in the debug HUD), and running in again when the throttle was closed and dynamics applied (and being controlled with train air). It vanished from the HUD in 1.0, and I'm not sure if it's still modeled the same way. Perhaps it wasn't done correctly, or introduced things that the physics otherwise couldn't handle. Might be interesting if some old heads in the project could think back on it and discuss.

    Edit: even MSTS had some modeling of slack. To check, set the view to the last car of a reasonably long train, release the brakes, and start. The locomotive (in MSTS and, I'm pretty sure, ORTS) will start some time before the caboose jerks into motion.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    known universe
    Posts
    1,915

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scottb613 View Post
    Hi...

    The bottom line is - the startup friction of a train should be irrelevant - as you are starting the train a single car at a time - it's the friction when traveling at a slow speed with the full weight of the train behind you that should stop you if you've exceeded the capacity of the locomotive... In ORTS - if you can start a train you can pull a train - given a constant grade without introducing of new variables...

    Whether right or wrong - these are the conclusions I've drawn from this series articles and my own testing of ORTS...

    Freight Train Resistance and Tonnage Ratings
    Part 1)
    https://archive.org/details/railwaym.../n100/mode/2up

    Part 2)
    https://archive.org/details/railwaym...e/146/mode/2up

    Part 3)
    https://archive.org/details/railwaym...e/204/mode/2up

    Your mileage may vary...

    Regards,
    Scott
    Good resource source, thanks Scott, Regards, Gerry
    Cheers, R. Steele [Gerry] It's my railroad and I'll do what I want! Historically accurate attitude of US Railroad Barons.


  5. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    New York, USA.
    Posts
    1,965

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by R. Steele View Post
    Good resource source, thanks Scott, Regards, Gerry
    Hi Gerry,

    Happy to help - while we deal with different era’s we seem to be working towards the same goals...

    LOL - this is what I get for perusing century old books that Dave occasionally links on Elvas... While the data is old the laws of physics should remain the same...

    What started me down this path is my steam locomotives “seem” to have difficulty pulling trains of similar lengths I see documented in photographic evidence from the era (granted there’s much unknown in photographs) - which would make sense if when I start I’m fighting the resistance of an entire train instead of each car in turn...

    Regards,
    Scott


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    139

    Default

    So currently if I understand right with OR there is Slack during movement but just not at the start? And with stopping there is bunching up?

    Another discussion that also prompted me to ask this was over on the steam forum for TS2020 - i wasn't sure what exactly the level of realism in ts was and after playing thought it seemed simplistic, but then there was a whole thread there one braking measures for going down grades dependent on whether it was a freight or passenger service; for passenger service or was ideal to have the cars stretched out whole for freight it was better to have them bunched , and the more I play TS the more I see it does have some more complexity to it even though I don't get the kind of in game level of reporting you see in OR and Msts for that matter. This brought me back to wanting to know what the current state of this with OR was, as well as what Slack and yank meant in this context, terms being clearer to me now

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    known universe
    Posts
    1,915

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scottb613 View Post
    Hi Gerry,

    Happy to help - while we deal with different era’s we seem to be working towards the same goals...

    LOL - this is what I get for perusing century old books that Dave occasionally links on Elvas... While the data is old the laws of physics should remain the same...
    Regards,
    Scott
    Brother, you said a mouthful...ain't it true.
    Cheers, R. Steele [Gerry] It's my railroad and I'll do what I want! Historically accurate attitude of US Railroad Barons.


  8. #18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Heruraha93 View Post
    So currently if I understand right with OR there is Slack during movement but just not at the start?
    That is not correct. In OR there is slack run-out when starting to move forward and slack run-in when starting to move in reverse. This easily tested. Start an activity with a long train, and as soon as the cab begins to move change the camera to the rear of the train. It likely will not have started to move yet. That would be because of slack.

    Now, if the physics properly account for the effect of the slack action, that's a whole 'nother question.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    .
    Posts
    2,432

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Heruraha93 View Post
    I am not deliberately wanting coupler breaks but I have been reading other players experiences in OR and Run8 and it does sound exciting to have to deal with the challenge of possible breaks.



  10. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    139

    Default

    thanks for that video - is that yours? its the first time i have ever seen a coupler breakage in game - can this happen at all in MSTS itself too?

    i love that csx trainset - i have been wanting something like that - did you make this activity then yourself? are there any CSX sets and related activities for MSTS/OR that come already pre-made? i am no good at making big activities

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •