Ideas for Run8 - Small Regions and Smart SDK to add to revenue streams

[SurvivorSean]

Before I begin, I'm in a conversation with moderators on some of the "drama". Since I've cooled down a bit, it's no sense giving up on a community because of one person. I've indicated my issues and how I will respond moving forward. Time to move on with some constructive ideas.

This is an idea I thought I mentioned once before, but just in case I'll mention it again. I'm not on any other Run8 forums nor am I planning to be on them. Mikey was on a live stream I had up earlier today so I'm hoping he was able to see the idea had as I laid it out. If he didn't it goes as follow, please feel free to forward to the team or any other forum as you see fit.

From what I can tell there are two factors as to why John or the team are currently against an SDK. 1) Supporting an SDK 2) Loss of revenue streams to the competition. But before I go into the SDK I'll give a very easy idea that can help revenue stream and help he many small servers that use to exist but have vanished from the Run8 world due to lack of activity.

1) SMALL REGIONS

I believe this was mentioned by the team a couple years ago. There are currently 3 regions in Run8 all of which are on some of the busiest mainlines in the United States. All regions contain a minimum of 2 routes with the SW being the most (and most popular). The last time I recall the SW being able to accurately have enough manpower to operate properly on the SW server I ran was at the start of Version 2. LA had not come out yet, so we had Mojave, Needles (Default), along with Cajon. It took a dedicated team of about minimum 6 people to run continuously all of the yard functions, dispatching, and local switchers. This was doable. When LA came out the requirements doubled, and Seligman & Bakersfield I estimate would require at least 40. In other words to run the entire SW as real as it gets (which means prototypical switching and operations you need 40 people not counting what you can run AI). Nobody can run that level of operation on an ongoing basis with either 1) falling behind 2) running smaller schedules, or less frequent trains to switch etc. In other words your running less that what the prototype actually does just fine.

When you are a small server who wants to run prototypically with prototypical levels (like myself) the only option you really have are the following 1) proto lance and just go for something less demanding 2) only operate certain sections of a region. Option 1 sounds easy enough but proto lance is something that is used when you don't have an area to scale. In this case we have a perfect 1:1 scale in virtual so doing so defeats the purpose. Option 2 requires dedicated people willing to sacrifice running entire sections of a route or even routes attached that are not running on the server. This often is a negative towards participation as end users want to be able to use everything they have purchased. It's like having a favorite destination with no place to drive, or a cool car with no road connected.

When you develop a small region it doesn't have to be a big project, or a busy line. Many regions are popular because of their beauty or some other feature and not the number of trains they run. The runs could be complete within an hour or two tops lets say for example. They could be a fun single track mainline with sidings, signals, at least 1 yard and some industries. This would allow 1 dispatcher to operate the line. There would be enough switching for 1 person, or multiple in groups with possibly conductors. Trains could call at certain times and wait for a human crew, if no crew comes aboard after so many hours then AI it. I'm thinking having 20 trains is sufficient in a 24 hour period but these are just examples.

The smaller region would allow anyone to host or run single player and not be overwhelmed with dispatching, running, and switching. It would allow anyone to host with a few friends, to a small group. You could even run 24/7 with a call board. Most of all the end users would have a complete route and plenty of hosts they could run with. If they wanted more they could find another client, or search for another server with another route. For the amount of time required to develop this would be a win win and grow the community stronger.

2) Software Development Kit

The software development kit would be an AS IS add on that would use the core Run8 system and allow development of new routes. I'm not sure how Run8 does their route editing but I imagine it is in collaboration. So lets say maximum of 5 people at one time could be developing a route. I remember a Chicago group developing a route once but it never went beyond a few people if I recall.

The key with development is allowing other SDK users to share in the experience. This wouldn't be like a normal server that anyone could join because you have a limit on who can be on the server. But not only that when connecting to the server because it's in development, the SDK would have to update all the clients connected with the latest route information.

Each development would have an assigned user key to other SDK's. In other words you can't just drop developers at a whim to find what 5 people want to run with you today for example. You have your team for each route. This prevents developing a route and just having sessions on your own.

Once the route is out of beta the magic begins. Run8 team could then access you route and see if it's something they can host. You could provide an additional hosting fee, or some agreement that allows you to share with others. Those purchasing the route would purchase on Run8's platform and/or receive royalty or access fees for the content you've produced. It's a win win because you get the exposure and possibly make a bit of money on the side as well.

Your SDK would have 5 available development slots for storing the routes. You could have X number of assets slots as well to insert or possibly purchase rights to Run8 assets.

I'm throwing out these numbers but honestly the numbers are not important. What is important is developing content to allow Run8 to gain momentum once again. Run8depot is a great forum but not everyone who has Run8 is on the Depot. Supporting anything is something Run8 does not have to worry about unless they can make money from it or want to spend time on it. Obviously their main focus is Version 3. I have not idea where they stand with it other than what has been relayed here. Not sure if this is something that can be brought in before 3 or after 3. But any of these ideas would breathe some life back into the product.

Run8 again is the best train simulator on the planet. For those of you that still enjoy it, that is cool because it's good to enjoy what you do. But there are reason why some don't and others are not around anymore.

BTW I'll post a live stream on this one. I'll be updating some of my websites on my social media as I'm changing some focus on a few things in the coming days and weeks.

Take care

Sean

[seagoon]

I'm perfectly happy to leave the complete development to Run 8 Studios.
In fact, I prefer to know that what I am using (now and in the future) comes from them, just as I like to know that TrainSimulations stuff comes from that developer.
These are small businesses which, so far, have done great stuff with their products.
I'd hate to see that watered down.

[NorthernWarrior]

Thus far 3DTS have shown no inclination to release their route editor or other SDK to a wider audience and I see little likelihood of that changing.

It would be nice to have the ability to add our own routes but it's not just the route, it's the signalling/despatcher board too. Quite happy to leave it in the purview of the professionals. If there is a particular route I fancy, then I've got Trainz, MSTS/OR or TS2021 to have a crack at building in.

[SMRY]

See, already a no go for some thus far. Yourself, Myself, Both, tried providing other options when it came to server, limited operation, was never any takers. I myself would think / feel some would have enough of an open mind, even going so far as to use what routes / regions available & create other RRs as stand-ins if you will. We even tried that before official TRC came along, no takers there. I'm certainly open minded enough, for haven done it a lifetime, don't feel the need to rivet count. The great feature MJ base rt. has going for it, is, those unable to purchase further, have a means to partake without the need to empty the wallets further, &, still fit in with pair of servers left. Anyways, in the end believe you be beating the O'l head against a rock & a hard place once again. On a good note, believe HB-Server may be trying / testing the Fla waters once again.

[SurvivorSean]

As for Highball I'm not rejoining Facebook (last I checked that is how they do things).

This is a very small pool Scott. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. But to refresh some people's memories it's time to take a ride back in the wayback machine and let's see back in 2012 what Run8 thought about this. You can do similar searches if you want. This is also public information that everyone had access to.

https://web.archive.org/web/20121029...m/future.shtml

As early as 2009 there was a Software Developers Kit. As a beta team members I assure you I had no idea what this was nor did I ask because I didn't care back then. I wanted to see what they could do and I understood their vision. Alaska Railroad for some reason was another route even back then they were interested in.

On Feb 23rd 2015 (it took me a while to find it) you'll see how many servers were advertised. There was actually and always has been more servers unadvertised here. Today I know of at least 2 personally unadvertised that have a few loyal members. But none were on this particular list.
https://web.archive.org/web/20150223...ommunity.shtml

Depot came in to fill the void for Dams if you will recall. Before that Depot was the great information it is today if my memory serves me correct.

Anyways there are like minded individuals out there that was looking forward to an SDK, or the ability to host servers. I gave up because it simply was no longer as real as it gets. But for those having fun more power to you.

Thanks

Sean

[cnwfan]

Playing with the same two Regions over and over again has gotten quite old fast for me. I wish the developers would open up the editor so more routes can be made. What ever happened to the party that was making the UP line out of Chicago? I would love to see the UP line west out of Chicago be done and not have to wait on the developers to find there way from California. Just my thoughts.

[SurvivorSean]

I "think" there was a personal difference with someone. I'll leave that to the imagination to figure out. Some kind of falling out perhaps. To be fair there is 3 regions, but your point is very valid.

Was looking forward to see what they were coming up with.

Thanks

Sean

[cnwfan]

To be fair there is 3 regions, but your point is very valid.

I know there are three but only two I really use was using that as a example.

[SMRY]

I'd really enjoy seeing other servers offered. though, no one seems interested in doing things own way so to speak. How many servers need to offer pretty much same ops, trains, symbols, etc. May as well just keep both HB / TD for that. Til another route / region, &, or, something fresh be offered has grown stale for many. Long ago, when R8America would allow us to join in forums. I spoke of no need to expand, if they continued to bring RW details /ops of the RRs in to what was already offered (MJ) at that time, would be so many things to do, think about on a daily basis, esp. outside operating trns themselves, would be no need, nor, time for other rt. spinoffs, those could come with some form of rt. creator down the rd. I still feel that way. It's as real as it gets, while lacking much. Anyone, haven been in the RR business a lifetime will know what's truly there, &, what's not. Same sort of thing with any simulator Flight, Trucking, Others. I've not lived those for a living wouldn't know the many many finer details that be missing from those types offered. I do operate ATS from time to time, &, in comparison, I find it about as real as it gets, but, I'm very sure could be so much more realistic, haven to bind your own loads, slap on chains, maintain a log book, truck maint, etc., the list goes on. same for any RR sim.
I always wanted to see RR / Trucking / Flight / Ship / Industry simulators all blended into one where everyone operated alongside one another within a server. Oh my O'l head spinnith, time for a break.

[seagoon]

..... I gave up because it simply was no longer as real as it gets.....

Yet in another recent thread you say that that it's the best thing since sliced bread, Sean.