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Thread: Spare Boards

  1. #11

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    It all depends on the union rules.

    I'd expect that in your example, the Niagara-Toronto subdivision would have crew assignments and an extra board to cover jobs that are called out of both terminals defining the ends of the territory.

    Union rules might require a Niagara crew to be deadheaded to cover the second section of your original train, or they might allow Toronto crews to cover the same movement dispatched under a separate train number... I know at my company both would be legal as long as the number of hours and assignments each crew base is supposed to have remains balanced out.
    Last edited by eolesen; 04-30-2021 at 10:51 PM.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurvivorSean View Post
    Wow that is tons of information thanks!

    So now a hypothetical question. As I mentioned our crews that work Niagara are based out of Port Robinson and their territory is the main between Buffalo and Toronto.

    In the sim I will have an initialization period of the sim to bring traffic, and motive power into the pool etc. But this could actually apply to a demand above the capacity of a single train. For example I've heard of a 2nd 421 out of Toronto when normally there would just be one train 421 and 422 a day.

    In that situation with the crews being based out of Niagara and likely Niagara crews and not Toronto crews (as they would book rest there at the hotel before returning home next trip), how would the crew logistics work? I'm actually not sure how the crew side plays out in Niagara in that case, but I have heard of crews deadheading (perhaps on CN or other roads), and even CN is known to taxi a crew a long distance for relief of another crew on the law etc. Just curious of everyone's experience in that respect as I intend on simulating the crews and everything from trainmasters to yardmasters, dispatchers, engineers, conductors, and even signal maintainers, foremen, and track maintenance workers.

    Thanks

    Sean

    Sean
    Hi Sean! I think that trying to simulate all of the "supporting" characters in the running of a train would be WAY to complicated. As you can see I have a bias toward non-operating employees{Just Kidding!!!} The reason is,just from the perspective of a "Crew Assignment Office",there are too many different variables,such as Engineer and Conductor availability,Crews nearly being "On the Law", Last minute Extras,Sick Call Outs,etc. Add to this the timing factor. By this I mean that,at least on my Railroad,if called,you had up to 2 hours to report to the location. This is giving me flashbacks to the disruption of my life when I first started! Sometimes,the CRO would foul up,realize they "forgot" something,call you,usually snotty{like it was your fault}tell you where to go and tell you the train should be moving in 10 minutes when you are at least an hour and a half away. I kid you not! If you do want to simulate this realisticly,you should make Crew Dispatchers nasty and arrorgant and who dont know how to talk to people. Enough of that! Good Luck with your project Sean, I wish you nothing but the best of luck! Brian

  3. #13
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    Recently with union rules in play, Extra Board, even regular crews, can't travel over the border.

    AFAIK currently, for an example.

    CP Trains 252/253, crew change at Rouses Point, NY. Canadian Crew brings 252 down to Rouses Point, and takes another north, while an American crew takes it from Rouses Point to Saratoga Springs NY, after bringing another job north to Rouses Point.

    Typically the way it's set up, 253 crew will bring the train to Rouses Point, crew change and hop on CN/CP/NS 930, and return to Saratoga Springs.

    Extra Board/Spare board, would fall in the same lines, however, with some roads, while on the extra board, you can hop from job to job, so as longs as it's on the territory you learned/training on. Again, example, Saratoga Springs - Rouses Point. You can bounce from I believe, the following jobs. D13, 252/253, D47, 930/931.

    Extra Board, can also toss you onto MoW based trains, switcher jobs, locals, road, or relieve someone that is out sick.


    Shortlines may have a "schedule" as well, but you can bounce around from job to job and be called in just as well as a class one. Rather frustrating when you are several years in already..
    https://i.imgur.com/LPZNEX4.png

  4. #14
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    Cool stuff guys and thanks for the support.

    I don't want to simulate the darker sides of railroading. I know some of the people and management can be shitty and the family life can be destroyed unless you have an understanding partner. I've seen those understanding partners and when you have one it makes both your lives so much easier. The crap from the job is enough stress than having to worry about your marriage falling appart.

    I also don't want to simulate assholes who run gates, trespassers, kids throwing rocks at trains etc. I do plan on simulating derailments however but not the smash up derby simulator. For example safety first and things will not always warn you. I remember times in Run8 where I side swiped cars. In RTS that is going to cost you big time. Running through switches as far as I know if they're not a spring switch will put the cars on the ground (looking to verify that one). But a minor derailment will require that amount of time and whatever is being fouled the number of hours necessary to get back on track. Major derailments of course will take much longer to clean up. Again no body counts, loss of job etc. It's a simulator but it's still supposed to be fun. Bottom line is the railway gets around it and gets back on it's feet as quick as it can. That just brings some more operating challenges, reroutes, detours, etc.

    So yeah I understand there is quite a bit I'm thinking about on the logic side and all the variables, but the graphics demand will not be as intense. The only thing that concerned me recently was how boring it can be sitting in and engine switching a train with an AI conductor Trust me I've been running these playthroughs through my head.

    Would love to get some actual asset creation done at some point as well. For now all I have is photo realistic images and place holders

    Thanks

    Sean

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurvivorSean View Post
    Cool stuff guys and thanks for the support.

    I don't want to simulate the darker sides of railroading. I know some of the people and management can be shitty and the family life can be destroyed unless you have an understanding partner. I've seen those understanding partners and when you have one it makes both your lives so much easier. The crap from the job is enough stress than having to worry about your marriage falling appart.
    Yeah, I know that feeling too well.
    https://i.imgur.com/LPZNEX4.png

  6. #16
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    Just so you know I appreciate all the input. This is my first Unity project and it's also the first full program I'm writing in C#. Yes I have programming background and produced RTS Beta for Run8V1 among other older programs such as Bridge master as well as way back in the day Commodore 64 stuff.

    The 3D art is something I need to learn at my own pace and not rush it. But then there is Unity that has lots of stuff already in place for primitives etc. I've thought about everything and I want to focus on another rail project with Unity. I think I'll be able to deliver something playable much sooner and the eye candy will be very enjoyable for the task at hand

    Please keep the conversation going the ideas, the challenges I may face, what would bore you or what you would like to see. RTS is not dead it's been a part of my mindset for 30 years now. But I need to build up to the level of detail I'm trying to obtain.

    For now I'll keep updates on my site address (when I update it). I may say something on YouTube about it but I want to surprise some people as well and not kill them with massive work only to see things put on hold. I've got to focus on what I can do now and I think I can do quite a bit and it will be railroad related. Hopefully everyone enjoys it when it comes out.

    Thanks

    Sean

  7. #17

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    Hello Shawn,, See your notifications at top of screen... also, I had you on the mind the last day or so, noting your NVLW. Can you tell me what / some of your favorite color(s) are. I ask as, would like to produce something within Rolling Line honoring NVLW, for a change of pace. Always looking for fresh ideas / spinoffs, you name it.

    lol... Please T-Herder, don't put me on notice, for I have strayed away from original topic... Keep up the great work Sean. You know we all love ya!... Don't let em fool ya!...

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurvivorSean View Post
    Cool stuff guys and thanks for the support.

    I don't want to simulate the darker sides of railroading. I know some of the people and management can be shitty and the family life can be destroyed unless you have an understanding partner. I've seen those understanding partners and when you have one it makes both your lives so much easier. The crap from the job is enough stress than having to worry about your marriage falling appart.

    I also don't want to simulate assholes who run gates, trespassers, kids throwing rocks at trains etc. I do plan on simulating derailments however but not the smash up derby simulator. For example safety first and things will not always warn you. I remember times in Run8 where I side swiped cars. In RTS that is going to cost you big time. Running through switches as far as I know if they're not a spring switch will put the cars on the ground (looking to verify that one). But a minor derailment will require that amount of time and whatever is being fouled the number of hours necessary to get back on track. Major derailments of course will take much longer to clean up. Again no body counts, loss of job etc. It's a simulator but it's still supposed to be fun. Bottom line is the railway gets around it and gets back on it's feet as quick as it can. That just brings some more operating challenges, reroutes, detours, etc.

    So yeah I understand there is quite a bit I'm thinking about on the logic side and all the variables, but the graphics demand will not be as intense. The only thing that concerned me recently was how boring it can be sitting in and engine switching a train with an AI conductor Trust me I've been running these playthroughs through my head.

    Would love to get some actual asset creation done at some point as well. For now all I have is photo realistic images and place holders

    Thanks

    Sean
    Sean,I want to fill you in on a question you have about "splitting switches". Never did it myself{though the nightmares about it only stopped recently!} Usually,if the switch is not what we would call a "Sampson Switch" which is a switch whose throw rods are not built to completely be immovable, you would simply force the points over,bending up the throw rods and if a hand throw,breaking the butterfly and then moving on. I know of people who split in one move multiple switches. In the good old days{now gone!} anybody who tore up the switches like that,usually in a yard,would find a track crew,buy them lunch and a case of beer,and they would fix the switches and nobody 'downtown" would know. So the answer would be, in most cases no derailment,just a damaged switch unless the dummy decided to reverse direction and then you would have cars on the ground as one truck would go one way and the other truck to an adjacent rack. Brian

  9. #19
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    Yeah I've been that dummy who's done that in Run8 a few times OK that's good to know. So the switch is no longer moveable then once that damage takes place. Point is it could delay operations. How long does it take for a repair on those in general. Obviously these days it would take some time to get maintenance out for it, but I imagine in central locations they have crews standing by for these issues.

    Thanks

    Sean

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurvivorSean View Post
    Yeah I've been that dummy who's done that in Run8 a few times OK that's good to know. So the switch is no longer moveable then once that damage takes place. Point is it could delay operations. How long does it take for a repair on those in general. Obviously these days it would take some time to get maintenance out for it, but I imagine in central locations they have crews standing by for these issues.

    Thanks

    Sean
    It wouldn't take as long as you'd think. Most Manned Yards will have Track Quarters,so that a busted up switch,or 2,or 3 could be put back together quickly. Once a track crew arrives,a switch could be repaired in about an hour. Brian

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