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Thread: Cool User Entered Parameter for Realism

  1. #1

    Default Cool User Entered Parameter for Realism

    Being new to OR I'm still discovering new things to enhance the sim. Forgive me if some of you know about this already.

    Reading the online manual, I learned about the "ORTSContinuousForceTimeFactor" that can be user-entered in the Engine block of the .eng file. Basically it simulates progressively decreasing efficiency of traction motors from increased heat under heavy demand. It is described in Section 8.7 of the manual.

    Using Nate C's Timetable mode for Scenic, and running a 14k ton grain train from Wenatchee, the traction motor load at notch-8 gradually dropped from roughly the mid-90% range at Cashmere down to 80-78% by the time I reached the Cascade Tunnel. Of course, the motors regain their potential once they get a chance to cool down.

    It's a subtle effect but I really appreciate it a lot.

    Ran this on the latest testing version only. I'm assuming that this will not work on the Stable version of the sim. At any rate, I thought it was great and thought I'd mention it.

  2. #2
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    Does not happen in the RW.

  3. #3

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    In RW, reducing notch to prevent overheat seems logical. Do advanced (todays) engine controls systems have this?

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  4. #4
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    Yep, there are quite a few of the "ORTS" parameters that can be used to modify a MSTS eng file to OR physics. You might want to teach yourself how to build an OR only engine file, so that it runs on the complete set of OR advanced physics parameters.

    There are a few ways to about this. I'll outline a couple of them --- read about them, and make your decision on how you want to approach this, if you choose to do so.

    1.) Use the "OpenRails" folder in the parent MSTS locomotive folder -- in the OpenRails folder is the include file with the same name as the engine in the parent folder ( one level up ) -- see screenshots for examples. This method leaves the legacy MSTS eng file intact with no OR modifications. A set of public domain OR standard engine files can be found here in the library >>> orts_std_eng_ver2.zip
    https://www.trainsim.com/vbts/tslib....ight&fid=35174
    bandicam 2021-06-15 14-31-01-992.jpg bandicam 2021-06-15 14-34-21-935.jpg

    2.) The other method is to build an OR only engine file...for examples of that method and how to go about it, I would recommend purchasing one of Erick Cantu's NAVS (North American V Scale ) products...start with the SOO Line GP7 Set found at Tiger Trains.
    https://www.tigertrains.com/Store/in...tegory&path=27
    This method still uses common folders and breaks the engine file down into component parts that can be used for other locomotives. No unnecessary MSTS parameters are used, all OR physics are used. The set Erick has produced is excellent.

    Either way will produce the same result, eng files that take advantage of OR physics and code to simulate more realistic performance.
    Cheers, Gerry
    It's my railroad and I'll do what I want! Historically accurate attitude of US Railroad Barons.
    Forever, ridin' drag in railroad knowledge.


  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuckoo View Post
    Being new to OR I'm still discovering new things to enhance the sim. Forgive me if some of you know about this already.

    Reading the online manual, I learned about the "ORTSContinuousForceTimeFactor" that can be user-entered in the Engine block of the .eng file. Basically it simulates progressively decreasing efficiency of traction motors from increased heat under heavy demand. It is described in Section 8.7 of the manual.

    Using Nate C's Timetable mode for Scenic, and running a 14k ton grain train from Wenatchee, the traction motor load at notch-8 gradually dropped from roughly the mid-90% range at Cashmere down to 80-78% by the time I reached the Cascade Tunnel. Of course, the motors regain their potential once they get a chance to cool down.

    It's a subtle effect but I really appreciate it a lot.

    Ran this on the latest testing version only. I'm assuming that this will not work on the Stable version of the sim. At any rate, I thought it was great and thought I'd mention it.
    This coding seems like a simplified way of implementing short-time ratings of DC locomotives (maybe leaning towards late-era DC locos where the software would force an engine throttle down to prevent damage? I'm not sure if such a thing exists, Erick Cantu as Gerry mentioned would probably know). Unless you are down below the minimum speed for "continuous" tractive effort, about 10-11 MPH typically (going off memory, it varies between locos, gearing ratios, etc.) and have DC locos, this gradual degrading of TE is not going to happen, even after several hours of slogging up a grade (NOT taking into account loss of engine efficiency due to lower oxygen concentration at higher elevation, which is definitely significant on lines into the High Rockies, Andes, Tibet, etc.). Properly-implemented short-time rating, where there will be permanent damage if run at too high of amperage for too long, would be great (would need some variables and/or an equation to represent how many seconds the engine can operate under a particular load before damage occurs, i.e. amperage is inversely proportional to how long that load can be sustained). It would be a very cool feature to have implemented and would add a lot of "immersion" factor to the sim, IMO. Things that have "high stakes" for the user, like risk of locomotive damage make the sim more "thrilling" (thrill is not something we get much of in rail simming, so we take what we get lol)
    Last edited by PerryPlatypus; 06-15-2021 at 06:06 PM.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by PerryPlatypus View Post
    ...Properly-implemented short-time rating, where there will be permanent damage if run at too high of amperage for too long, would be great (would need some variables and/or an equation to represent how many seconds the engine can operate under a particular load before damage occurs, i.e. amperage is inversely proportional to how long that load can be sustained). It would be a very cool feature to have implemented and would add a lot of "immersion" factor to the sim, IMO. Things that have "high stakes" for the user, like risk of locomotive damage make the sim more "thrilling" (thrill is not something we get much of in rail simming, so we take what we get lol)
    Yeah, I would love to see this fully implemented...maybe someday.

    Regarding the parameter "ORTSContinuousForceTimeFactor" which I think dates back to the 2013-2015 time period, it was meant to provide a time limit at which the DC traction would operate at maximum force ( in conjunction with the ORTSMaxTractiveForce curves ) -- at which time ( the time factor ) the locomotive would revert to the maxcontinuous force possible. I'm not sure it was fully implemented in the diesel code...therefore I have not used it. That's the extent of my knowledge.

    I would assume the user would have to be using the Advanced physics option, this would not be working with simple physics.
    [all subject to correction by someone who knows what the heck they are talking about )
    Cheers, Gerry
    It's my railroad and I'll do what I want! Historically accurate attitude of US Railroad Barons.
    Forever, ridin' drag in railroad knowledge.


  7. #7
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    What does happen in the RW with a Class 66 is that after a sustained period of running in notch 8 e.g when ascending Saunderton Bank with the now defunct "Binliner",the loco automatically operated its Turbo Cooldown Cycle after the throttle was closed some way before the summit and would not operate at more than Notch 6 power until that cycle had completed.The TMs are cooled by air blast all the time.
    Never known this happen on Class 59 (all varieties) and Class 60.

  8. #8
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    I can tell you, you can still overheat, and burn out traction motors. I have done so recently on an SD70M-2. Burnt them out from being overheated and overused. Whoops.

    So reducing your notch from 8 to a lower number can help. After all, there is a reason on the GP40-2 and GP38-2 models, show how long it can sit in the red for amps. Blowers for air or not, they get extremely hot, especially hot summer days!
    https://i.imgur.com/LPZNEX4.png

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